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Thread: Pinball Arcade: The Best Pinball Video Game Ever Made?

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    Thumbs up Pinball Arcade: The Best Pinball Video Game Ever Made?

    Kotaku has an article detailing FarSight's new multiplatform release The Pinball Arcade (they also link to the 15 minute developer diary). It's available now on handhelds and is scheduled for release on XBLA and PSN in March. The four launch titles are Black Hole, Ripley's Believe It or Not, Tales of the Arabian Nights, and Theatre of Magic. Upcoming DLC tables include Cirqus Voltaire, Medieval Madness, Monster Bash, and Attack from Mars.

    There's been a lot of negative comments on this forum regarding the Williams compilation, but I hope most of you are willing to try their new platform. The physics engine has been improved, landscape and portrait views are available (portable devices), and they've acquired licenses from all major manufacturers of physical tables.

    FarSight and Zen are different companies making different products: pinball simulation vs. fantasy pinball. Claiming one developer is better than the other is like comparing Bohemia's ArmA to DICE's Battlefield. They both put a lot of effort into their products, and pinball fans should be happy so many tables will be available on the market from two talented studios.

    Updates:

    • The mobile versions currently have an improved UI for table selection which will be patched into the consoles.

    • All DLC tables will feature the lighting upgrades seen on the PS3/Vita versions.

    • The PS3/Vita versions share a license (one purchase for both platforms).

    • DLC for the consoles will be released as a monthly 2 pack priced at 4.99 USD / 400 MSP.

    • The first DLC tables are Medieval Madness and Bride of Pin•Bot. The pack should be available on the consoles the first week of May.

    • Medieval Madness is the table of the month for April and may be played unlimited for free on Droid and iOS devices.


    Differences between Xbox 360 and PS3/Vita:

    • The PS3 version features a lighting upgrade which FarSight will eventually patch into the Xbox 360 version. It is tweaked to create the illusion of natural lighting, which eliminates the washed out effect and makes the dynamic reflections on the ball much more apparent.

    • The PS3 version includes Facebook integration. Scores are shared across all mobile platforms and may be posted to Facebook. However, a Facebook account is not required to post to the leaderboards (the PSN ID is used instead). Scores posted from mobile devices are denoted with parentheses.

    • The PS3 version includes two extra options on the table select menu:


      • Challenge: Beat the target score for each table to progress and increase your Challenge Mode score and level.

      • Tournament: Compete online using rules based on authentic pinball tournaments for prizes and bragging rights. There will be tournaments for everyone from beginners to experts.


      Both modes will be activated after more tables have been added.

    • Most of the table bugs in the 360 version appear to have been fixed, including the > 10 billion score issue.

    • The Xbox 360 version looks slightly crisper and more vivid due to its hardware upscaler and gpu. The sharper DMD is most noticeable (which may further irritate purists since the display isn't a dot matrix).

    • The Vita version includes landscape/portrait view and touchscreen support.
    Last edited by blue; 04-13-2012 at 12:09 AM.
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    After playing it on the phone over the past couple days I gotta say I didn't enjoy it at all. Though you say there's portrait and landscape mode I couldn't find the option maybe its getting updated? I brought that up since the controls are a nightmare and playing with the table a different way around may help with that. There's also no way the physics aren't garbage, real pinball does not play like that.

    Tables are grrrrrrreat replicas of the originals as always and I would recommend getting the demo to any pinball player just for that.

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    Its so true blue, being able to live in this age where we have 2 great Pinball Devs providing us with a constant supply of Pinball goodness. We sometimes forget how good we have it, this will also push both Devs so as the consumer we win due to the ever increasing quality of the Products.

    Im happy that the Fighting genre also came back, truely we are blessed.


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    I'm enjoying this a lot on my Android phone, it's amazing to have this on the go! I also can't wait for future dlc. It's coming to the 360 late March and I might get a table or two on there as well, depending on the graphic quality

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    I'm looking forward to this one. I have PHOF:WC for the wii (I haven't played it for a while, but I LOVED that it tried to simulate real tables). The wii version does not have "Mediaeval Madness", which was the only one of the tables I was able to locate and play on "in real life" (I found one in an arcade in downtown Vancouver, not sure if it's still there now).

    I was never able to locate PHOF for xbox.
    Last edited by bclewis; 02-25-2012 at 06:22 PM.

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    Pointless bloody thread.

    blue, you know full well that a thread already exists on the subject.

    You also know full well that plenty of people around here have both praise and criticisms for Farsight's work. It's not a binary thing.

    Once again, your real purpose here is to be argumentative; to pop up with another divisive thread title, paint a bunch of people out as recalcitrants, and generally muckrake while acting as if your real concern is the wellbeing of pinball.

    It's old. Move on, lose the chip.

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    I haven't visited this forum in some months.

    Pleased to see you are as friendly as ever.

    I apologize if there was a similar thread; the topic is derived from the title of Kotaku's article (hence my inclusion of a question mark).

    Quote Originally Posted by Element View Post
    There's also no way the physics aren't garbage, real pinball does not play like that.
    I've owned several of these tables. The physics are the best recreations I've seen. The engine is a huge improvement over Visual Pinball as well as FarSight's previous efforts (Williams and Gottlieb collections).

    How long has it been since you played the actual tables?
    Were the machines clean?
    Have you played them at different pitches?

    Zen Pinball and Pinball FX 2 are a lot of fun, but they play much differently in comparison to physical pinball machines.
    They took our pinball machines!
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    Quote Originally Posted by blue View Post
    I've owned several of these tables. The physics are the best recreations I've seen. The engine is a huge improvement over Visual Pinball as well as FarSight's previous efforts (Williams and Gottlieb collections).
    Any word on whether they're planning new versions of the other PHOF:Williams tables? I'd be stoked to see updated versions of some of those, including Taxi, Black Knight, and Sorceror.

    I spent a few days trying to track down a Taxi table in Vancouver a few years back when I was playing PHOF. I was *sure* I had seen one somewhere, but never found it, and later wondered if it had been in a dream.

    [ I see elsewhere that at least Black Knight and Sorceror are also on the schedule, nice. Agree that there is plenty of room for both Zen and Farsight's offerings; I for one still plan on snapping up each of the Zen tables as soon as they drop! ]
    Last edited by bclewis; 02-26-2012 at 02:39 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bclewis View Post
    Any word on whether they're planning new versions of the other PHOF:Williams tables? I'd be stoked to see updated versions of some of those, including Taxi, Black Knight, and Sorceror. ]
    Greetings Lewis!

    There's a thread on the second page called "FarSight launches and new title" But I'll catch you up to speed best I can.

    FarSights new title is called "The Pinball Arcade". It's already dropped for Android and iOS and will be out for Xbox 360 by the end of March.

    The Pinball Arcade will feature a brand new engine with improved physics, lighting, sound etc. including new modeling effects like 'cube mapping' that will give the ball real time reflective effect. (you can check it out on their tech demo on You Tube).

    The first four tables at Launch will be: Tales of the Arabian Knights, Theater of Magic, Ripley's Believe it or not, and The Black Hole.

    Tables that have been confirmed for DLC in the first six months are: Monster Bash, Attack from Mars, and Cirqus Voltaire. You can also expect to get a redo of the original tables for PHoF:Williams collection.

    FarSight has acquired the licenses' of Bally, Williams, Stern and Gottlieb. Besides reproductions of current real tables, they have stated that they will be doing classic Electro-Mechanical machines like they did with Jive Time.

    Finally, this new game engine will work exactly like Pinball FX 2, you'll download the engine and there hoping to maintain at least 1 new table/pak per month and in an early statement, they're hoping to have 50 tables out total by the end of the first year!


    Hope this helps you at all. Cheers M8!
    Last edited by SBVIPER; 02-26-2012 at 04:20 AM.

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    There is already a Farsight Pinball Arcade topic. Can a mod please put them together? Thank you.

    That said, Pinball Arcade will be awesome

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    Yay an update came out which fixed several of my issues, controls are still poor unfortunately. I think the xbox version of this will be playable but as it is its too expensive and broken on phone.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LukkyNL View Post
    There is already a Farsight Pinball Arcade topic. Can a mod please put them together? Thank you.
    We're in the process of a major re-organization, so yes, these will get combined

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    I searched the forum. You're right; there's been several threads discussing FarSight's next project.

    I think it's better not to combine it with the one Lukky is alluding to. It's four months old, and the majority of it consists of people bickering over Pinball FX 2 versus The Williams Collection. It's the same in all the other threads. :/

    Isn't it wiser to start off fresh (sans arguing) now that the game has been released and people are staring to play it?
    They took our pinball machines!
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    After playing Farsight's pinball for the last two weeks and a healthy dose of real pinball I simply cannot play Zen Pinball anymore. I can play Pinball Arcade and then switch to the real thing (Theatre of Magic) and they feel almost identical.

    The ball in Zen is too heavy and the loss in momentum is just plain ridiculous. If a ball comes streaking down at your flipper it takes a lot of skill and perfect timing to cradle it, but in Zen it is a trivial matter.

    I realize that Zen is catering to a more casual crowd so they have dumbed things down a bit to make things easier but it just isn't for me.

    I had to end my very first game of Ms. The Splosion Man after 45 minutes because I didn't think the game was ever going to end and I had things to do.

    How is that supposed to be fun?
    Last edited by ND3G; 02-27-2012 at 06:00 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blue View Post
    I searched the forum. You're right; there's been several threads discussing FarSight's next project.

    I think it's better not to combine it with the one Lukky is alluding to. It's four months old, and the majority of it consists of people bickering over Pinball FX 2 versus The Williams Collection. It's the same in all the other threads. :/

    Isn't it wiser to start off fresh (sans arguing) now that the game has been released and people are staring to play it?
    There was no news for four months. And comparing pinball games isn't bad at all. What's wrong with people ventilating their thoughts?

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    Two problems.

    First, there's over 150 posts of speculation before anyone comments about having played The Pinball Arcade. Much of that involves a flame war based off contempt for the Williams compilation. There's nothing wrong with constructive criticism, but the "this game sucks because it's not like Pinball FX" comments aren't helpful.

    Shouldn't we judge FarSight's tables on their technical merit instead of preexisting bias?

    Second, there have been other threads about this topic. If two are combined, they should all be combined--which would be a little ridiculous. This is not the first time someone has made a similar thread on an old topic. I don't understand why this one is taboo, especially when it links to an article by the same name.


    Quote Originally Posted by SBVIPER View Post
    Finally, this new game engine will work exactly like Pinball FX 2
    It's slightly different so far on the iOS and Droid versions. The game sells for one dollar and comes with the Table of the Month, currently Tales of the Arabian Nights (there is also a free version which allows TotAN to be purchased from within the game for $1). Black Hole is $2, Theatre of Magic is $3, and Ripley's Believe It or Not is $4. DLC will be priced similarly. Tables will be free to play during online/cross-platform tournaments. I doubt Microsoft is going to allow FarSight to release tables for a dollar a piece, so the price structures are likely to vary across platforms.

    they're hoping to have 50 tables out total by the end of the first year!
    I believe they said 50 tables over "the next two years." That will probably be the platform's lifespan. This is an absurd number considering Microsoft's policies for XBLA, but hopefully FarSight will surprise us.


    Quote Originally Posted by Element View Post
    Yay an update came out which fixed several of my issues, controls are still poor unfortunately. I think the xbox version of this will be playable but as it is its too expensive and broken on phone.
    Yeah, they've been good about the updates, but I'm curious how this will factor into their release on XBLA. Microsoft's certification process prevents developers from tweaking releases, unless they do it in a clever way, like taking advantage of the title managed storage.

    I'm hoping there's several differences between the XBLA/PSN and portable releases. For example, the high score integration with Facebook is awful. I hope the consoles have built in leaderboards.


    Quote Originally Posted by ND3G View Post
    After playing Farsight's pinball for the last two weeks and a healthy dose of real pinball I simply cannot play Zen Pinball anymore. I can play Pinball Arcade and then switch to the real thing (Theatre of Magic) and they feel almost identical.
    Same here. It's almost creepy how accurate the physics are. That must have involved hundreds of hours of tweaking.

    I still enjoy Zen's tables, but it's getting difficult to switch back and forth between the two platforms. Experiencing The Pinball Arcade for the first time was like playing Forza after months of Need for Speed.
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    Any news or speculation on the achievements? Do you think they will mimic Zen's pattern of three per table? Maybe have an achievement for completing all basic goals and all wizard goals (like PHOF) and then something else.

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    One of the achievement whore monkeys will surely post them here as soon as they're announced.

    The Pinball Arcade also has a set of basic goals and a set of wizard goals for each table. Once the wizard goals are completed, the table's tilt sensor can be disabled (but doing this prevents scores from being posted to the leaderboard ).
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    Moving to General Discussions, since it's not about Pinball FX2.

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    attack From Mars is going to be off the hizook!!!!!
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    Monster Bash will be the best im hoping they bring Terminator 2 and Lethal Weapon to The Pinball Arcade also.


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    I downloaded the Android demo. You can download all four tables there and give them a spin.

    For a real estimate, I need to wait for the X-Box version, cause playing with my thumbs on the small cell display can't compare to the feeling of having a controller and a tv screen.

    As I'm one of those videogamers, who wasn't a pinball fan before Pinball FX 2, there hopefully will be a lot to discover.
    For a first impression, I liked Ripley's a lot. Theatre of Magic surprised me a bit. The table seems to be handing out millions like candy on Halloween.

    Regarding physics, I can't really say much, cause I never really played pinball on real machines, so I have to trust the experts, when they say that it feels real.
    Subjectively I found the ball faster and less heavy compared to PBFX2. I didn't see this as a huge issue, cause I played hundreds of different video games in my life, so I don't have an issue, if Tekken plays differently than Street Fighter. Same applies here.

    All in all, I'm looking forward to try out all these tables, which are just myths and legends for me at the moment, but I'm also looking forward to what Zen will do.
    It's great to have so many options to play video pinball.

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    FarSight Facebook page announcement!!!

    First 2 DLC for The Pinball Arcade;

    Medieval Madness and....dare I say; "Bride of Pinbot"

    The Pinball Arcade slated for release on March 28th

    Cheers!

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    Quote Originally Posted by SBVIPER View Post
    FarSight Facebook page announcement!!!

    First 2 DLC for The Pinball Arcade;

    Medieval Madness and....dare I say; "Bride of Pinbot"

    The Pinball Arcade slated for release on March 28th

    Cheers!
    Hmm thought Monster Bash was part of the First DLC? anyways yey to Bride of PinBot.


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    After pretty much hating the William's collection I was really hesitant with their latest product. I know it has been a while but we only got the collection in the UK in 2011; so from where I am there is only a year between William's and this new platform.

    However I have to admit it plays much better. I have a Motorola Razar (a very fast phone) and it runs these like a dream.

    The ball feels heavier than it does on Williams.

    I still hate the fact that there's no shadow work at all however. The ball still retains that 2D look it has. I am not sure if this will be the same for the console versions.

    But for a phone app. it's actually really quite good. My hat's off to them for actually improving their engine and producing something that feels fluid and good to play.
    My Youtube channel I have started, Playthroughs, game chatter - that sort of thing

    Check it out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNDpP...el_video_title

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    march is almost over it this comming out next week ?
    i don't have a pci use ps3 browser

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    Quote Originally Posted by maink View Post
    march is almost over it this comming out next week ?
    They said 3/28 for a while now. I'm not sure if it's going to stick though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by maink View Post
    march is almost over it this comming out next week ?
    According to their Facebook page, April 10th is the release date.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SwitchBlade View Post
    According to their Facebook page, April 10th is the release date.
    I think thats just for the PS3/Vita release.


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    Quote Originally Posted by SwitchBlade View Post
    According to their Facebook page, April 10th is the release date.
    Thanks for the update. I was wondering if they changed the release date for the PS3 version.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shogun00 View Post
    They said 3/28 for a while now. I'm not sure if it's going to stick though.
    Well maybe...

    Larry Hryb ‏ @majornelson

    Wrecked Revenge http://mjr.mn/H6IwXm & The Pinball Arcade http://mjr.mn/H6IwXn are scheduled to come to Xbox LIVE Arcade this Wednesday

    11:02 AM - 26 Mar 12 via TweetDeck · Embed this Tweet

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    always delays in video games , i just checked psblog an indeed it s not scheduled for march 28th , only 2 more weeks ?
    i don't have a pci use ps3 browser

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    Quote Originally Posted by x Zot x View Post
    Well maybe...

    Larry Hryb ‏ @majornelson

    Wrecked Revenge http://mjr.mn/H6IwXm & The Pinball Arcade http://mjr.mn/H6IwXn are scheduled to come to Xbox LIVE Arcade this Wednesday

    11:02 AM - 26 Mar 12 via TweetDeck · Embed this Tweet
    Hmm will know on Weds, surely a launch trailer would be released by FarSight before?


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    Sadly I don't think this is scheduled for release tomorrow. They're already releasing Wrecked, Kung Fu Strike and South Park this week. Plus Farsight wouldn't confirm this at all and Major Nelson's previous tweet is gone.

    I think this is scheduled for release on April 10th, so it's not too far off.

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    It didn't come out today. Larry is a liar.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hectorpuppet View Post
    It didn't come out today. Larry is a liar.
    It got Delayed a week, FarSight will be announcing a Date later today.


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    FarSight plans to release monthly DLC in a two pack priced at 400 MSP.

    The first pack may be Bride of Pinbot and Medieval Madness.

    The achievements are as follows:

    Achieve a top 5 local high score on a table - 5 G
    Complete the standard goals on a table - 15 G
    Complete the wizard goals on a table - 30 G
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    Thanks for the info blue


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    It's now out, IMO the game delivers and is a different twist in video game pinball.

    Not disapointed !

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    I'm digging it. Just got to 3rd place on the Ripley's leaderboard.

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    Anyone who owns a PS3 might want to hold off purchasing it for the Xbox. FarSight have just announced that buying The Pinball Arcade once will allow owners to play it on both the PS3 and Vita. The shared licenses extend to future tables as well.

    Another consideration is future support. FarSight plans to add features over time. Microsoft's certification process is lengthy, and they charge developers $40,000 after the first title update. Patches tend to be rolled out much faster and with more frequency over PSN.

    Hopefully Plus subscribers will receive a 20% off discount.
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    Updated the thread with info on April's DLC.

    It's silly how quick everyone has been to point out the differences with Pinball FX 2. Again, FarSight set out to create a platform for pinball simulation, not a fantasy pinball clone. Hardly anyone has compared Pinball Arcade to the Williams and Gottlieb collections. The graphics have been overhauled, there are noticeable improvements to the camera angles and user interface, and the new ball physics & dynamic reflections trump Zen's efforts.

    Anyone whining about minor issues like the menus and lack of social features should revisit Pinball FX (which was created by a team of equal size). It offered three poorly designed rip-offs of classic tables, atrocious physics, meager sounds, and cartoonish graphics/lighting. But it worked as a downloadable pinball game and paved the way to the current platform.
    They took our pinball machines!
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    Quote Originally Posted by blue View Post
    The consoles will be released as a monthly 2 pack priced at 4.99 USD / 400 MSP.

    [*]The first DLC tables are Medieval Madness and Bride of Pin•Bot.
    This is great news! Two classic tables a month for only 400 space dollars? I cannot wait

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    Quote Originally Posted by blue View Post
    Anyone whining about minor issues like the menus and lack of social features should revisit Pinball FX (which was created by a team of equal size). It offered three poorly designed rip-offs of classic tables, atrocious physics, meager sounds, and cartoonish graphics/lighting. But it worked as a downloadable pinball game and paved the way to the current platform.
    FX1 was released when? 2007? It's 2012 now. Farsight should have learned a thing or two from FX2.

    The difference between FX1 and FX2 was very impressive. I was expecting a similar jump in tech and features for PHoF to TPA. I was let down. Simple as that. I was expecting more than just "noticeable improvements".

    Still a fun game though.

    I have a feeling that if TPA was developed for only the consoles instead of releasing it on every conceivable platform, the final product would have turned out MUCH MUCH better.
    Last edited by KGSoloman8000; 04-07-2012 at 11:26 PM.

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    FarSight isn't trying to copy Zen. They're doing something different.

    A lot of the features in Pinball FX 2 are superfluous to hardcore pinball players (social integration, ball camera, cartoon toys, etc.). With their limited manpower, FarSight seems to have focused on the most important aspects of design, like ball physics, dynamic lighting, and accurate reproductions of tables.

    I prefer their menu system. Seeing the cabinets as I scroll through the list feels more like an arcade experience. Each table is a separate entity with its own history, goals and rules (too many of Zen's tables are twists on a similar design). I hope they don't include gimmicks like Superscore & Wizard Score to encourage players to buy more tables.
    They took our pinball machines!
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    I had not played Williams Pinball Classics for a few months, so was playing it a lot over the last few days. The physics seem much more realistic on Pinball Arcade. Loving Theatre of Magic

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    having played "Williams Pinball Classics" on the wii (i returned it to gamestop the next day, too spoiled with how Zen handles the ball and tables) i hope this one will have better physics on the 3DS when it comes out/when i get it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blue View Post
    It's silly how quick everyone has been to point out the differences with Pinball FX 2. Hardly anyone has compared Pinball Arcade to the Williams and Gottlieb collections. The graphics have been overhauled, there are noticeable improvements to the camera angles and user interface, and the new ball physics & dynamic reflections trump Zen's efforts.

    Anyone whining about minor issues like the menus and lack of social features should revisit Pinball FX (which was created by a team of equal size).
    I don't think that a comparison is so far fetched, if there are 2 Pinball Products out there.
    In gaming it's pretty common to have two competing series in one genre. You have Fifa and PES, CoD and Battlefield, Forza and Gran Turismo...etc. And when rating the newest title, there are always two levels of comparison. Against the last installment (as you pointed out) and against each other.

    From a business point of view, you also have to do that. You can see that reflected in Farsight's pricing model. They charge roughly the same as Zen does. And I don't think that their decision was made out of the blue.
    F.e. they could have optioned to release their title like an Indie developer on XBLA for less than regular prices, but they made a conscient business decision not to. And if someone charges almost the same money as someone else for a similar product, I think it's natural that people compare what one product does different (better/worse) than the other. Comparing TPA to PBFX1 is therefore problematic.

    I don't want to do something simple, like saying you have Fifa 12 and the new PES and PES fans point out that it is still better than Fifa 07.
    You compared the games based on the roughly estimated number of persons involved in the development of the game. This is one way do to it. But then you asked yourself, why is that? Why is a company that is in the business since more than 20 years not able to acquire a bigger development team to have a more polished product.

    From my pov this can only be answered by two reasons and might be a combination of both.
    1. They can't
    I don't know Farsights numbers, but for a company who's been in the video gaming business for that long, they obviously do something right to survive. Looking at their titles, I don't assume that they had really big hits, so I would guess that they are getting by, but aren't able to grow.

    2. They don't want to
    Staying small, getting by and having solid numbers can also be a decision for their business model. If it works out well, why risking a running business for the sake of expansion.

    This part now is highly speculative: I think that they can't, because they don't want to.
    In one thing, I think, you are very correct. Farsight just seems to want to transport the original designs and transport them to newer plattforms. Therefore you need people, who can do the transportation. They don't want to develop new games, so they don't need to hire a creative team for example to come up with new ideas and designs.
    They also don't need to work with artists to create new designs, cause everything is already there, they just want to transport it. Therefore the elements of the product, which are not directly related to the transportation are of lesser importance to Farsight.

    As a customer I have to ask myself, how important they are to me. It's 2012. I can still buy a car with a solid engine, which has a tape deck instead of a fancy cd/mp3 radio, which doesn't have airbags or a navigation system, when I don't think that I want those things.
    But I think I can still ask, why my car dealer wants almost the same price for this new car (made in 2012) than for a car from last year, that has all the fancy new shiny technology.

    Luckily, Pinball games aren't cars, so I can get both.^^
    Last edited by Verjigorm; 04-08-2012 at 09:20 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blue View Post
    It's silly how quick everyone has been to point out the differences with Pinball FX 2
    Says the guy who created a thread entitled Pinball Arcade: The Best Pinball Video Game Ever Made?

    If you don't want comparisons, why did you create a thread that invites comparisons?

    Answer: because you wanted to stir up trouble, belittle the people you disagree with, getting a few smacks in on Zen along the way.

    You're not even subtle, mate. Get back under your bridge.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Womble View Post
    Says the guy who created a thread entitled Pinball Arcade: The Best Pinball Video Game Ever Made?

    If you don't want comparisons, why did you create a thread that invites comparisons?

    Quote Originally Posted by blue View Post
    the topic is derived from the title of Kotaku's article (hence my inclusion of a question mark).
    Quote Originally Posted by Womble View Post
    Because you wanted to stir up trouble, belittle the people you disagree with, getting a few smacks in on Zen along the way.

    You're not even subtle, mate. Get back under your bridge.

    Quote Originally Posted by blue View Post
    Pleased to see you are as friendly as ever.
    Need a hug?
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    Quote Originally Posted by blue View Post
    FarSight isn't trying to copy Zen. They're doing something different.
    Did I say copy? I said they should have learned a few things from FX2. Totally different. Basically they should have tried a little harder to make a better game. Aren't we supposed to be evolving and getting better instead of taking steps backwards?

    Quote Originally Posted by blue View Post
    I prefer their menu system.
    You are entitled to your opinion... but really? You can't be serious!
    If FX2 used that awful menu, you would be cursing Zen even more than you do now. Scrolling thru 30+ tables one at a time sounds like a lot fun, lol. Scrolling thru 50+ sounds even better!


    Quote Originally Posted by blue View Post
    Need a hug?
    Need a life?
    Last edited by KGSoloman8000; 04-08-2012 at 08:33 PM.

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    Best ever? Not quite. The Pro Pinball series still is the standard for pinball sims. Little Wing's sims are also a contender (if only for Monster Fair and Fairy Tower). The Xbox 360 version of this game, while quite good (though rushed), falters against Pinball FX 2. The Xbox 360 release is worse than the iOS version (leaderboard scoring glitch in this version); unless they greatly polish up their user interface, fix the leaderboard scoring glitch, and have the PlayStation 3 graphics (which look pretty awesome), this will lose against Pinball FX 2.

    On the contrary, this is the best video pinball game on the iOS (playing this on an iPad 2) an yes I also have Zen Pinball. While this version's user interface leaves little to be desired, the leaderboards are decently polished (especially once they have Game Center support) and the nudge controls are excellent, well balanced. I'm not too fond of Zen Pinball's nudge feature, but everything else is great. Unless Pro Pinball comes out on the iOS (same engine and all), this is the best pinball app out there on the iOS.

    I would give the iOS version a 9/10, while the Xbox 360 version would get around a 8/10. Zen's pinball games on the Xbox 360 and iOS would get a 9/10 and 8/10, respectively.
    Last edited by HardcorePinballGamer4Life; 04-08-2012 at 09:07 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HardcorePinballGamer4Life View Post
    The Pro Pinball series still is the standard for pinball sims.
    I agree.

    Quote Originally Posted by KGSoloman8000 View Post
    Did I say copy? I said they should have learned a few things from FX2. Totally different. Basically they should have tried a little harder to make a better game. Aren't we supposed to be evolving and getting better instead of taking steps backwards?
    Zen spoils their users with gimmicks. I was pleased FarSight stuck to the basics. Pinball Arcade is an improvement over the Williams and Gottlieb compilations.

    An operator's menu would have been nice, but I never touch these in Pinball FX 2 after changing the DMD color. Cunning Developments did this better when they allowed players to adjust everything, including the level of wear & tear on the machine.

    And I think there is more for Zen to learn from FarSight: ball physics, dynamic reflections, table difficulty, call attendant button, unique table goals, etc.

    Aside from the minor bugs, my only complaint with Pinball Arcade is that they dropped the token system. I hoped FarSight would have expanded on this, using extra credits to unlock promotional art & videos, designer interviews, colored pinballs, and mirror modes.

    You are entitled to your opinion... but really? You can't be serious!
    If FX2 used that awful menu, you would be cursing Zen even more than you do now. Scrolling thru 30+ tables one at a time sounds like a lot fun, lol. Scrolling thru 50+ sounds even better!
    I'm ambivalent about Pinball FX2's menu. It's functional but is too reminiscent of a touch screen interface.

    I enjoy scrolling through the tables, looking at their designs, and picking one to play. It resembles an arcade experience. Zen's tone is too fanciful.

    This isn't a problem yet. FarSight could easily fix this by adding sortable categories of tables: All (A-Z), Decade, Manufacturer, Designer, Favorites.

    I doubt they will break 40 tables given the lifespan of the current consoles.

    Need a life?
    Womble is the one trolling. He seldom adds anything productive to my comments and criticizes me at every turn.
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    I'm loving TPA so far. The drawbacks that I've seen posted here & on other forums are minor to me. (menus, lack of HD sound, lack of game options, game bugs)

    If I wanted to play a decent selection of pinball I'd normally have to drive about 10 hours to get to a proper arcade. With TPA I get to play good recreations of real pinball tables - for $10 that is a bargain. Ultimately I just want to play some pinball... I don't need much else in the way of extras.

    Zen has been a great source for pinball and I'll continue to buy all the tables they release. I prefer the physics in TPA along with the sights and sounds of real pinball tables, so I'm stoked that we have a choice. Also, I never need to see another table based on a super hero again. :-)

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    Just a reminder:

    While I enjoy reading your discussions, personal attacks and being a tattletale will not be tolerated. Keep it friendly, or keep to yourself.

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    Blue, that's a great idea about expanding the credit system to buy unlockables. Farsight nailed the core gameplay, I just wish they would have put a little more effort into the extras and UI.

    About the menu... FX2 reminds you more of a touchscreen menu? I don't know about that. TPA's menu is ripped directly out of the iOS version with very minor changes. It's really easy to tell that TPA's menu was designed for touchscreens.

    I actually liked the PHoF virtual arcade better than the current menu in TPA. I wish they would have kept it like that (but streamlined it a little more) with a much larger arcade and some DLC machines already in place with a "Coming Soon" or "Out of Order" sign on them. I am actually quite surprised that they decided to drop that idea from the past game.

    All I'm trying to say is... It's a lot of fun, but it could be better... I think that is a statement you can agree with.

    I'm having a blast playing TPA. I managed to get the Wizard goals out of the way for Ripley's. That table is great. I just wonder why it was designed without kickbacks.

    The only goals I have left to do are on Black Hole... I'm struggling quite a bit to get into it. Why must the gate close after a pop bumper is hit on the lower level? That makes the lower playfield pretty dangerous lol.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KGSoloman8000 View Post
    Why must the gate close after a pop bumper is hit on the lower level? That makes the lower playfield pretty dangerous lol.
    Yeah, that's a particularly nasty feature. Can someone confirm that the real table has the same behaviour? Doesn't it kind of defeat the purpose of the "open gate" feature on the right inline of the upper playfield?

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    I downloaded the Pinbot/Medieval Madness pack today for my Android and the interesting thing was that they made a slight change to the UI for choosing your table.

    In the old version each table had its own "page". Now, when you're on a table, you also get a glimpse of the tables left and right of your selected table.
    It's just a minor adjustment and doesn't really solve the issue that you still have to rotate through the tables, but I think it shows that Farsight is trying to improve here.

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    Just got done playing a long game of Street Fighter II - FX2/360. Of all the Zen games, this table has the least predictable ball. If the Pinball Arcade ball behaved a bit more like the ball on SFII, I would be happy. At least the SFII ball feels like it has some mass.

    I played the demo of Pinball Arcade, and it is slightly better than PHOF. I am on the fence at the moment whether I'll buy it though. I might wait for more tables (and bug fixes).

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    Added a section to the original post for anyone curious about the differences between the console versions. I've spent a few hours playing all of the tables on the PS3. The lighting upgrade is excellent and makes Pinball Arcade feel much more distinct from The Williams Collection. For those playing it on the 360, try lowering the brightness, contrast, and gamma on your display. It makes a huge difference.

    There are also two extra modes in the PS3 version: Challenge and Tournament. I don't know if FarSight plans to include them in the Xbox 360 version since it lacks Facebook support.

    Quote Originally Posted by IndyRC_Racer View Post
    If the Pinball Arcade ball behaved a bit more like the ball on SFII, I would be happy. At least the SFII ball feels like it has some mass.
    FarSight have gone to a lot of trouble to accurately model the differences between these tables. The physics in SFII Tribute aren't any different from the rest of Zen's tables.

    I think the most noticeable difference is the offset flippers, which prevent the similar trajectories found in most of Zen's designs.
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    After buying and playing Pinball Arcade, I would have to say that the weight of the ball seems okay. It is just a shame that there are small things that make playing Pinball Arcade more frustrating than it could be.

    - Balls jumping over/going through flippers.
    In real life, a ball can jump a flipper (more common during multi-ball). However, in Pinball Arcade it seems that the ball is able to jump/go through the flippers, especially around the tips of the flippers. While this doesn't happen often, it does happen enough to be very disappointing.

    - Lack of realistic rolling resistance
    All of the tables feel like the playfield is brand new, it has been waxed, and the ball has been polished. This results in overall play that is a bit unrealistic when compared to the real world. I've played a few brand new real world pinball machines, and they did tend to play faster than a broken in machine. For the record, I hated playing on a brand new machines. I always felt the machine was better to play when it had been broken in a little bit. Call this personal preference.

    None of the points above will prevent me from buying future tables. But what it will do is lower the replayability for me due to frustration. It is a shame that FarSight didn't (or couldn't because of licensing constraints) produce a representation of the tables as they existed and I played at real world arcades - call it an OverSight.
    Last edited by IndyRC_Racer; 04-25-2012 at 01:05 AM.

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    i was dreaming about a 'wear' feature on zen's table that would show on the table graphs, and somehow tweaks lightly the physics !

    Of course you'd be able in the options to make it new again and/or turn the 'wear' on and off ...

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    When do they bring the DLC?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Skode View Post
    When do they bring the DLC?
    Zen is definitely much better with customer relations and communicating release dates.

    TPA has already released two 2-packs of DLC for some, but I'm guessing that the xbox & playstation DLC will arrive sometime in (hopefully early) May. I'm not sure if we'll get just 2 tables at a time or if they are waiting to release the console DLC in 4-packs. I love me some TPA but it would be nice if their website had current info.

    edit: I've seen people ask the same question about console DLC dates on their facebook page but no solid answers yet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Skode View Post
    When do they bring the DLC?
    They should release all PS3 versions first.

    There are rumours in their forum about getting both DLC packs at the same time. They also said that they try to release DLC at the same time, for both xbox and PS3. I wonder if that happens. The PS3 europe release already is a disapointment for me.
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