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Thread: Still no anti-aliasing in this game! For the love of god!

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    Default Still no anti-aliasing in this game! For the love of god!

    WHY! Why must you not put any anti-aliasing in this game. I refuse to buy these extra tables at this point though I sure want to. Not only can you guys not get your game running in 1080p you don't even support anti-aliasing. Meaning this game will just be rebought again on another next-gen console with better graphics and old tables for sale. YOU WILL inevitably rerelease all this stuff I know it. Why would you not? This game would look amazing in 1080p with 4xMSAA. Clean as a real table almost.

    Seriously, how is it that an ancient game like Warhawk can do 4xMSAA and you guys cannot even manage to throw FXAA or some other crappy method in there just to eliminate the jaggies. It's Pinball. This isn't Uncharted 2. Put some freakin' AA in your game or your next game. Your tables are beautiful and then you go and ruin that look with jaggies up the wazoo.

    Rant over--
    Last edited by Khronikos; 09-05-2012 at 08:45 AM.

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    Senior Member s-carnegie's Avatar
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    What jaggies, this game looks like 10/10 on my tv anyway. 720, 1080 no dif to me it looks perfect. You likely just need glasses.

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    Yeah Zen, no 4xMSAA, what were you thinking...

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    This rant seems a little misdirected.

    The current HD consoles were ill-equipped for the "hi def" generation. Microsoft and Sony cheaped out at the beginning. The GPUs in both platforms do not actually have the capability to maintain 720p, let alone 1080p, with features like anti-aliasing, depending on the visual load. There are plenty of games, including those by big developers, with huge budgets, that must sacrifice AA or resolution depending on exactly what they need to do. Very few games on the HD consoles actually render at 1080p.

    Belittling Zen Pinball because "it's just pinball" misrepresents it. Zen Pinball / Pinball FX shoot for nearly photo-realistic tables in terms of modeling, textures, and shaders. It must also run at a locked 60fps for stability and playability. Which it does. The graphical sophistication of Zen's product is actually up there with games that have larger budgets from big studios.

    The Playstation 3 is theoretically more powerful than the Xbox 360, and a handful of games such as Uncharted display this, because they are very specifically designed for the PS3's odd architecture. When your technology is multiplatform however, you can rarely take advantage of that, so most games are restricted to what is possible on the 360.

    The fact that an old game like Warhawk has AA means little. Warhawk's visuals are very crude, and doesn't use a lot of effects and shaders that games later into the generation did. It was also built specifically for one platform, allowing it to be optimized.

  5. #5

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    Why the sudden obsession with anti-aliasing in gaming? Pretty sure you just heard the word somewhere, heard that it was good, and now you want it.

    Zen Pinball 2 looks great, no need to obsess over it looking better.

  6. #6

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    Except the 360 has a superior GPU that makes anti-aliasing somewhat easier than on PS3. So if anything I suspect the game is locked down to what the PS3 can do WITHOUT using the SPUs (because anything done using the SPUs would be a PITA to port to other systems).

    The end result is the same though, the game has to settle for what can be relatively easily done on all consoles.

    I always felt Zen Pinball didn't play as well or smoothly as Pinball FX, probably due to it being tricky to port over to PS3. Makes me wonder if something like the physics might actually be running on the SPUs now after all.

    I do agree though, I think I would rather sacrifice a little of the flashy arcade effects if that meant I could run the game in 1080p. After all, I was able to run Pro Pinball in 1080p on PC on far worse hardware than the PS3. Then again, that was a purely realistic pinball simulation, far different to what Zen produce.
    Last edited by Alex Atkin UK; 09-05-2012 at 07:06 PM.

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    "The GPUs in both platforms do not actually have the capability to maintain 720p, let alone 1080p, with features like anti-aliasing, depending on the visual load."

    "Belittling Zen Pinball because "it's just pinball" misrepresents it. Zen Pinball / Pinball FX shoot for nearly photo-realistic tables in terms of modeling, textures, and shaders. It must also run at a locked 60fps for stability and playability. Which it does. The graphical sophistication of Zen's product is actually up there with games that have larger budgets from big studios."

    Let me just say right now you have no idea what you are talking about and have never coded a line in your life. This game is not some epic GPU hogging masterpiece bud.

    Total hogwash. They remaster games like Ico and Okami in 1080p native. Many more are in 1080p on PSN that do more than this game ever will.

    If you think Warhawk was an easy game with no shaders you are seriously mistaken. That is a 32 player game man with 4xMSAA and it came out years ago. Sure, it's dated. Of course it is. But there are 32 players flying around large maps with tanks and soldiers shooting guns and a large draw distance.

    Having less jaggies really helps it along still to this day. Jaggies destroy games. Until devs start making their games proper this argument will not die. One of the reasons I wish they would PORT THIS TO STEAM!

    Sorry, but Pinball isn't stressing the PS3 LOL. They have plenty of room to put in some kind of AA. MLAA and FXAA are almost free on the PS3 so your argument is dead right there.

    There are games like Super Stardust and anything by pixeljunk that run in 1080p native and no jaggies. There are multitudes of games that run at 720p with 10x more than pinball will ever have going and they also have 2xMSAA in the case of Uncharted 2 and usually MLAA or some sort on many others.

    Pinball is not stressing anything on ANY system. And I am tired of looking at these tables with jaggies. It takes me out of my immersion all the time when it should not need to. They can at least afford 2xMSAA there is no doubt in my mind.

    And no I don't need glasses you are the one that obviously needs some glasses. The jaggies are crystal clear. I play on a 42 inch TV and they have been crystal clear and ugly as sin since the first release. Sorry, but it just makes me think there will be another release with the same content just better looking at some point. I say put your game on Steam and be done with it.
    Last edited by Khronikos; 09-08-2012 at 09:09 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Khronikos View Post
    "The GPUs in both platforms do not actually have the capability to maintain 720p, let alone 1080p, with features like anti-aliasing, depending on the visual load."

    "Belittling Zen Pinball because "it's just pinball" misrepresents it. Zen Pinball / Pinball FX shoot for nearly photo-realistic tables in terms of modeling, textures, and shaders. It must also run at a locked 60fps for stability and playability. Which it does. The graphical sophistication of Zen's product is actually up there with games that have larger budgets from big studios."

    Let me just say right now you have no idea what you are talking about and have never coded a line in your life. This game is not some epic GPU hogging masterpiece bud.

    Total hogwash. They remaster games like Ico and Okami in 1080p native. Many more are in 1080p on PSN that do more than this game ever will.

    If you think Warhawk was an easy game with no shaders you are seriously mistaken. That is a 32 player game man with 4xMSAA and it came out years ago. Sure, it's dated. Of course it is. But there are 32 players flying around large maps with tanks and soldiers shooting guns and a large draw distance.

    Having less jaggies really helps it along still to this day. Jaggies destroy games. Until devs start making their games proper this argument will not die. One of the reasons I wish they would PORT THIS TO STEAM!

    Sorry, but Pinball isn't stressing the PS3 LOL. They have plenty of room to put in some kind of AA. MLAA and FXAA are almost free on the PS3 so your argument is dead right there.

    There are games like Super Stardust and anything by pixeljunk that run in 1080p native and no jaggies. There are multitudes of games that run at 720p with 10x more than pinball will ever have going and they also have 2xMSAA in the case of Uncharted 2 and usually MLAA or some sort on many others.

    Pinball is not stressing anything on ANY system. And I am tired of looking at these tables with jaggies. It takes me out of my immersion all the time when it should not need to. They can at least afford 2xMSAA there is no doubt in my mind.

    And no I don't need glasses YOU are the one that obviously needs some glasses. The jaggies are crystal clear. I play on a 42 inch TV and they have been crystal clear and ugly as sin since the first release.
    Well, I don't mind the graphics as much as you do but I can tell you this. Everything on these forums is seen by a Zen representative and all questions, comments, concerns, and suggestions are taken seriously. I would't be surprised if you get an official answer early next week when once they get back to work. In the mean time I would try to enjoy the tables as they are. The tables still provide the best video pinball around and have come a long way in the past couple of years. Cheers.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Atkin UK View Post
    Except the 360 has a superior GPU that makes anti-aliasing somewhat easier than on PS3. So if anything I suspect the game is locked down to what the PS3 can do WITHOUT using the SPUs (because anything done using the SPUs would be a PITA to port to other systems).

    The end result is the same though, the game has to settle for what can be relatively easily done on all consoles.

    I always felt Zen Pinball didn't play as well or smoothly as Pinball FX, probably due to it being tricky to port over to PS3. Makes me wonder if something like the physics might actually be running on the SPUs now after all.

    I do agree though, I think I would rather sacrifice a little of the flashy arcade effects if that meant I could run the game in 1080p. After all, I was able to run Pro Pinball in 1080p on PC on far worse hardware than the PS3. Then again, that was a purely realistic pinball simulation, far different to what Zen produce.
    Pro Pinball is all prerendered, 2D graphics and physics.

    The majority of 3D games on PS3, even retail games that can afford to spend more on tech, don't have antialiasing. Warhawk is very much an exception. A lot of games don't even render at 720p.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Solitude View Post
    Pro Pinball is all prerendered, 2D graphics and physics.

    The majority of 3D games on PS3, even retail games that can afford to spend more on tech, don't have antialiasing. Warhawk is very much an exception. A lot of games don't even render at 720p.
    With all do respect, and I do have a lot I love your tables and hope some day you guys port to STEAM. THE VAST MAJORITY of games on PS3 have AA and many many more have FSAA or FXAA or MLAA. Sorry, but you clearly do not quite no the story here. I think you should have the team take a look at your PS3 SDK a little closer because they offer FXAA/MLAA almost for free and it requires at most a week's time to implement with 3 or so devs.

    I know this for fact. I'm sorry but you are wrong. There are very few games out today that do not use some sort of FXAA/MLAA. I cannot even name one at the moment. Infamous 2 was the last major Sony game without AA and it had high resolution textures to hide it pretty well.

    Seriously, man. I know devs personally who have the SDK and they can port FXAA or MLAA into their game from Sony in about 3 days with no problems depending on code. Obviously, I have no idea how your code works.

    For instance, I can list from my own personal collection, All Resistance games use Quincunx which is awful, Killzone 2 does as well and looks good still to this day, 3 uses MLAA, LBP2 uses MLAA, Uncharted 2 uses MSAA 2x, 3 uses FXAA Custom, EVERY SINGLE remastered PS2 game uses at least 2xMSAA and the ICO collection uses MLAA with 1080p native, Shatter and Stardust use 4xMSAA, I think Siren uses 4xMSAA, all pixeljunk games are entirely jaggy free, Williams own pinball game I believe uses MSAA, Heavenly Sword uses MSAA, LA NOIRE uses 2xMSAA and that game has a LOT going on, little games like Wakeboarding HD have 2xMSAA I think, Dead Nation uses MSAA at 1080p, and I don't need to really go on here.

    The list is endless. Almost EVERY single game on PS3 uses some sort of AA no matter how bad.

    No doubt in my mind you guys could port MLAA into this game or FXAA within a week's time and there really is no reason at all you should not be able to use 2xMSAA.
    Last edited by Khronikos; 09-21-2012 at 09:19 PM.

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    Do you actually see a lot of jaggies? What kind of TV or monitor are you using and how close are you sitting? I haven't really noticed any except maybe the Iron Man table on marvel pinball, particularly when the table was loading. All the ps3 games with AA that I do have usually have minimal AA that offer little advantage in terms of graphical clarity/sharpness compared to performance hit they take. I have Red Dead Redemption, Metal Gear 4, Modern Warfare series all have some form of AA but still look pretty bad with a lot of jaggies and drops in frame rate. MW plays pretty smoothly but they don't have a lot of high res textures. And in my opinion, performance and smooth game play for pinball is much more important than having some crappy AA. I think PS3 games with great graphics and AA and good performance are rare. I can't actually think of any off the top of my head. That being said, I wouldn't mind if ZP2 had AA as long as I had the option to turn it off if I was getting unacceptable drops in frame rate.
    Last edited by surf1der; 09-22-2012 at 12:06 AM.

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    You're really hung up on anti-aliasing as if it somehow is the single defining element of graphics quality. It isn't. If you code graphics (which you appear to imply) or talk to devs, then you really ought to know that. I personally think the game looks just fine, but I understand that different people have different opinions on what is acceptable in terms of graphical quality. It is also a possibility that any issues you notice might be a mix of software and hardware; not all televisions or monitors are made equally. That possibility cannot be dismissed.

    The part of your post that incites me to respond is your list of games, which frankly, I find absurd. You compare a current generation game to something like Ico HD. Really? Come on. It's difficult enough to compare either performance or empirical results (i.e., frame rate) from one game engine to another, but dragging out last generation engines is an awful comparison. And you're very dismissive of what a game engine does outside of rendering graphics. The assumption that filtering, texturing, or anti-aliasing techniques are cost-free is just plain wrong. Without that assumption, one simply cannot blithely state that a given feature can (and should) be implemented without a performance hit.

    Quote Originally Posted by Khronikos View Post
    With all do respect, and I do have a lot I love your tables and hope some day you guys port to STEAM. THE VAST MAJORITY of games on PS3 have AA and many many more have FSAA or FXAA or MLAA. Sorry, but you clearly do not quite no the story here. I think you should have the team take a look at your PS3 SDK a little closer because they offer FXAA/MLAA almost for free and it requires at most a week's time to implement with 3 or so devs.

    I know this for fact. I'm sorry but you are wrong. There are very few games out today that do not use some sort of FXAA/MLAA. I cannot even name one at the moment. Infamous 2 was the last major Sony game without AA and it had high resolution textures to hide it pretty well.

    Seriously, man. I know devs personally who have the SDK and they can port FXAA or MLAA into their game from Sony in about 3 days with no problems depending on code. Obviously, I have no idea how your code works.

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    http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread.php?t=46241

    A little dated, but still informative.

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    what does jaggies mean , i play on 480i , it sucks i know ... on hulk when the screen moves it becomes all blury , if thats what you mean by jaggies
    i don't have a pci use ps3 browser

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    Quote Originally Posted by maink View Post
    what does jaggies mean , i play on 480i , it sucks i know ... on hulk when the screen moves it becomes all blury , if thats what you mean by jaggies
    I post on Beyond3d regularly. Anyway, there are tons of games on PS3 with great graphics and AA. I just listed a bazillion of them lofl. Sorry, but Sony's implementation of MLAA is almost free from an engine standpoint. Guerrilla Games and others have pretty much confirmed this. At least if you leave a SPU open for it which there is simply no way this game is using all the SPUs to max. It's friggin' pinball.

    Your assertion that AA is not one of the main things about graphics is absurd. Do you have a PC? Are you aware of how great games look without jaggies. It is literally on the top 3 most important things about 3d rendering because it makes the picture appeal to your eyes in a more realistic fashion. I have a high-end fully backlit LED 42 inches and yes I sit close and yes I have a high-end PC as well. There is a reason hollywood studios use enormous amounts of AA.

    The fact is this game needs some kind of AA. If it doesn't get it fine but please look into porting this great game to STEAM where you would find a very nice audience as there are no good pinball games on there. Please, from a financial standpoint porting to STEAM is not that costly and they basically give you free patches or near that. Many devs are surprises at how well their game do on Steam.
    Last edited by Khronikos; 09-23-2012 at 03:11 PM.

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    "It is also a possibility that any issues you notice might be a mix of software and hardware; not all televisions or monitors are made equally. That possibility cannot be dismissed."

    Please. Enough with the crap. I have a very expensive system that includes high-end products all around.

    The game has a ton of aliasing. It's that simple. If you can't see it you are blind or you have no idea what you are looking at.
    Last edited by Khronikos; 09-23-2012 at 03:13 PM.

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    @Krhonikos: If it looks that terrible to you then don't buy any dlc. I can't recall anyone but you complaining about how terrible the game looks because of a lack of aa. I rarely notice it around habitrails when I actively look for it but don't even notice it during game play. The game most likely plays at a native resolution of 720p due to its 3d support. The ps3 just can't handle 3d at 1080p. Pinball fx2 will be available at the windows store when win8 releases. Perhaps you would prefer that version. I haven't heard nor i have i cared to ask what type of aa the pc version will have, if any. I haven't heard of any plans to release on steam.

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    i have no idea what you talking about , it says im my signature i don't have a pc , i still game on a big old school tv .
    i don't have a pci use ps3 browser

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    Quote Originally Posted by maink View Post
    i have no idea what you talking about , it says im my signature i don't have a pc , i still game on a big old school tv.
    He quoted the wrong person.

    To answer your question, jaggies are those ridges on what suppose to be a straight line. Just play a PS1 game and you will notice them instantly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Khronikos View Post
    I post on Beyond3d regularly. Anyway, there are tons of games on PS3 with great graphics and AA. I just listed a bazillion of them lofl. Sorry, but Sony's implementation of MLAA is almost free from an engine standpoint. Guerrilla Games and others have pretty much confirmed this. At least if you leave a SPU open for it which there is simply no way this game is using all the SPUs to max. It's friggin' pinball.

    Your assertion that AA is not one of the main things about graphics is absurd. Do you have a PC? Are you aware of how great games look without jaggies. It is literally on the top 3 most important things about 3d rendering because it makes the picture appeal to your eyes in a more realistic fashion. I have a high-end fully backlit LED 42 inches and yes I sit close and yes I have a high-end PC as well. There is a reason hollywood studios use enormous amounts of AA.

    The fact is this game needs some kind of AA. If it doesn't get it fine but please look into porting this great game to STEAM where you would find a very nice audience as there are no good pinball games on there. Please, from a financial standpoint porting to STEAM is not that costly and they basically give you free patches or near that. Many devs are surprises at how well their game do on Steam.
    We'll be doing a PC version that has support for AA, etc.

    Not sure how we're supposed to be feature-equivalent with a 1st party title with a boatload of engineers and a bazillion-dollar budget. (Althoguh I'd also like to point out that there are a lot of big-budget games on PS3 that don't have AA. Not to mention the whole Skyrim thing...)

  22. #22

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    Sit farther away from your television. It's free anti-aliasing. No. I'm not joking.

    Trying to make comparisons to Hollywood special effects is also absurd. Hollywood gets to run frame-by-frame renders on a server farm. Incidentally, back in the days of Jurassic Park and T2, texturing was considered the key element of making things look realistic.

    On my PC, if I have a choice, I would generally take the best features that offer a playable frame rate in order of texture filtering, lighting, resolution, and then anti-aliasing in that order. I know what I like to look at. Maybe your opinion differs, fine, whatever. But you keep trying to make this point that AA is free, either from a development standpoint (it's not, someone has to code it) or from a hardware standpoint (it's not, keeping an SPU open is still a cost).

    I would be a lot more sympathetic if your posts were remotely close to polite (to the devs). I don't yell at the wait staff because a meal doesn't match my expectations.

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    I NEVER said, to my knowledge, that this game looks terrible. It doesn't look terrible but there is certainly room to make it almost timeless with a Steam version. These consoles are ancient history I understand that and rarely do my gaming on them anymore besides the Sony exclusives.

    But I know that this game could look a lot better. For that reason I don't want to shell out for the DLC though I really do want ALL of it.

    Simple fix would be to release this on Steam. I can guarantee you good sales because there is literally NO COMPETITION on steam and many people are fans of this game and all your tables. GREAT to hear that you may want to consider that approach. I think devs who don't are missing out on some great communities.

    IF this was released on steam I would buy every dlc you have without a question asked. I don't want to compare this to big budget games but you asked for the comparison when you said hardly any games have any AA. Almost everyone coming out today has some kind of post processing AA and too many are sadly sub 720p. To many of us with PCs this gen is dead in the water besides the first party devs. I play literally all 3rd party games on PC with my PS3 pad. It's like an extension of my PS3 lol.

    I didn't really think I was getting out of hand or yelling at anybody. This is a forum. I'm typing not yelling. Anyway you have it I still think a post processing method could help the PS3 version along but I won't beat the point any further. It's not like I would ever touch the PS3 version again if you ported this to Steam.

    Now I am not really asking for any coding to be done to satisfy my little heart I was just saying Sony's MLAA does not require a ton of resources though obviously it has a ton of sub pixel drawbacks although Naughty Dog's newest version of their custom AA looks to be the best yet. As for the Pixar comparisons STOP taking my quotes and ideas out of context. The only thing I was stating is that in ALL 3D rendering AA is one of the most important things any dev pays attention to these days as far as polishing the picture and making it appear more real or less diminished.

    I was talking to the Costume Quest guys on Steam about this, they had NO AA in their games, and they were nice enough to make an option for post processing in game OR supersampling from the Steam Menu which basically makes their artstyle look timeless. It fixed everything wrong about the game for people who play on large monitors or really anyone in general. I'm sorry but jaggies destroy immersion for a good part of us. I think people are just waaaaaay to used the awful quality of consoles this gen besides the first party stuff. Yes, Skyrim looks like an abysmal and utter disaster on consoles and the PS3 version is the worst.

    On PC the modders have made that game, and others like Dark Souls, ten times the game they were on consoles and that is just a fact. I wish everybody could play those games with high-end PC because they are seriously missing out. Same with BF3 and all the others. The detail in 1080p at 60fps with tons of AA is simply amazing.

    I'm sorry if people cannot grasp the idea that this game would be stunning in 1080p with either forced MSAA from menu or in game options. It would indeed look stunning and would be all I need for pinball for some time. I hope it someday comes to Steam. I would personally stay the hell away from GFWL as most people hate it and it does affect sales plus patching costs a boatload.
    Last edited by Khronikos; 09-24-2012 at 12:39 PM.

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    We get it already. You're a pc/steam fanboy. You think it is very easy to implement AA and 1080p on console games and there is no reasonable explanation as to why zen studios should not implement these features immediately for consoles. You feel sorry for us because we don't understand how great 1080p and AA is. And you refuse to support the developers by buying DLC until you get AA and/or 1080p even though you like the game and you think the game looks good but not good enough. We got it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by surf1der View Post
    We get it already. You're a pc/steam fanboy. You think it is very easy to implement AA and 1080p on console games and there is no reasonable explanation as to why zen studios should not implement these features immediately for consoles. You feel sorry for us because we don't understand how great 1080p and AA is. And you refuse to support the developers by buying DLC until you get AA and/or 1080p even though you like the game and you think the game looks good but not good enough. We got it.
    Surf, let it go. Don't be so argumentative.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BarbieBobomb View Post
    Surf, let it go. Don't be so argumentative.
    I call it like I see it.

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    "You think it is very easy to implement AA and 1080p on console games..."

    Again, feel free to take everything I say out of context.

    Nobody said 1080p was easy on consoles. It's quite obviously not. AA on the other hand much easier. Maybe not quality AA but AA nonetheless.

    Sorry to be a fanboy of something or another but this is a zen pinball 2 forum and I, as an owner of the game, have a right to voice my opinion.

    "You feel sorry for us because we don't understand how great 1080p and AA is." True, but you see you do know how great they are because there are many games that use them. I have at least 10 1080p native PSN games. Ico looks absolutely fabulous on PS3 and, despite being a PS2 game, the artstyle totally still holds up. To one of those comments said way up above they couldn't even get Shadow of the Colossus running at 1080p so these old engines are not exactly easy for the PS3 to do.

    Anyway, wasn't trying to ruffle any feathers on here but criticism is just that to fanboys. Sorry, but criticism improves games if people take it to heart. I alone was the one complaining on Costume Quest and those guys were nice enough to take my complaints to heart because in reality they agreed with me. Despite me being too overzealous, I do apologize but it seems no one hears you otherwise these days, I still think I have a very important point that has been made.

    And I hope you guys get on Steam at some point. All we have is some lame pinball game at the moment that nobody buys.
    Last edited by Khronikos; 09-24-2012 at 07:01 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Khronikos View Post
    "You think it is very easy to implement AA and 1080p on console games..."

    Again, feel free to take everything I say out of context.

    Nobody said 1080p was easy on consoles. It's quite obviously not. AA on the other hand much easier. Maybe not quality AA but AA nonetheless.

    Sorry to be a fanboy of something or another but this is a zen pinball 2 forum and I, as an owner of the game, have a right to voice my opinion.

    "You feel sorry for us because we don't understand how great 1080p and AA is." True, but you see you do know how great they are because there are many games that use them. I have at least 10 1080p native PSN games. Ico looks absolutely fabulous on PS3 and, despite being a PS2 game, the artstyle totally still holds up. To one of those comments said way up above they couldn't even get Shadow of the Colossus running at 1080p so these old engines are not exactly easy for the PS3 to do.

    Anyway, wasn't trying to ruffle any feathers on here but criticism is just that to fanboys. Sorry, but criticism improves games if people take it to heart. I alone was the one complaining on Costume Quest and those guys were nice enough to take my complaints to heart because in reality they agreed with me. Despite me being too overzealous, I do apologize but it seems no one hears you otherwise these days, I still think I have a very important point that has been made.

    And I hope you guys get on Steam at some point. All we have is some lame pinball game at the moment that nobody buys.
    Hi Khronikos, No feathers ruffled here (except maybe Surf), welcome to the forums, btw

    I hope you'll stick around! We do appreciate input from fans, so keep it coming!

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by BarbieBobomb View Post
    Hi Khronikos, No feathers ruffled here (except maybe Surf), welcome to the forums, btw

    I hope you'll stick around! We do appreciate input from fans, so keep it coming!
    Don't be silly Barbie. I was just teasing him. This has been a great thread. I agree with you. I can also appreciate the great input from fans and I to would like them to keep more of the same coming! I mean this is great constructive criticism. Hell, solitude commented on it and he rarely comments on anything so this thread has been extremely important.

    "Still no anti-aliasing in this game! For the love of god!

    WHY! Why must you not put any anti-aliasing in this game. I refuse to buy these extra tables at this point though I sure want to. Not only can you guys not get your game running in 1080p you don't even support anti-aliasing. Meaning this game will just be rebought again on another next-gen console with better graphics and old tables for sale. YOU WILL inevitably rerelease all this stuff I know it. Why would you not? This game would look amazing in 1080p with 4xMSAA. Clean as a real table almost.

    Seriously, how is it that an ancient game like Warhawk can do 4xMSAA and you guys cannot even manage to throw FXAA or some other crappy method in there just to eliminate the jaggies. It's Pinball. This isn't Uncharted 2. Put some freakin' AA in your game or your next game. Your tables are beautiful and then you go and ruin that look with jaggies up the wazoo.

    Rant over--"

    Great stuff. Thank you Kronikos. Your input has been invaluable. Hopefully we can see 1080p and some great AA for ZP2 on the ps3 in the near future!

  30. #30
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    http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/...and-remastered

    Competition could get a lot hotter if this return of Pro Pinball turns out to be good. I am pretty sure it would be if the kick hadn't been so low since they have an old time pinball designer on board and are aiming for high-end prerenders. I know I am pledging a couple dollars towards it. I think Zen can definitely beat them up at least on PC as they have a timeline reaching into late next year for the tables to appear. It does appear as if their kickstarter will fall short but they should have given it much more time and hope they still do. Prerendered of course has some drawbacks.

    I would think you guys, if not held back by exclusive deals, should get your game on Steam pronto. You have the tables that the others don't for sure and all those DLC ones and the originals could be ported to 1080p fairly easily even if the assets are not that high they would still look pretty damn good. You could also make some optimizations. I would pretty much buy all of them if you had a decent bundle.

    But these other guys still make a good game as well. Have to see how it will turn out. Pinball on the brain!

    Also, I'm pretty sure surf is just goofing. Maybe that rant was a little too much. All the same that is how I feel. Really it comes down to me wanting a definitive experience. Instead of ranting on the aged PS3, yes I am so damn tired of it, I should have just suggested you guys try your hardest to get this rolling on Steam. Sorry about that. I know the PS3 can be tricky at times.
    Last edited by Khronikos; 09-27-2012 at 12:49 AM.

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