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Thread: ZEN Studios: Shame on you!

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    Angry ZEN Studios: Shame on you!

    Zen studios: You should be ashamed of yourself. DEEPLY ashamed.

    Why? Quite simple. Me, and thousands of other WiiU users have paid for mulitple tables in ZEN Pinball 2. There are still bugs in these tables, we have brought to your attention over a year ago. The Spiderman table is one of the worst ones where after every multiball the screen doesn't return to it's correct setting.
    In over a year, you haven't done SHIT for us to solve these issues. We haven't had an official tournament EVER since this game was released.
    And I am not even talking about the (at least) 8 month delay on the Dr. Strange tables and the complete lack of communication from your side.

    Haven't you wondered why the sales on the 2nd batch of starwars tables is so much lower on the WiiU compared to the first tables? Some people simply don't trust you guys anymore. We have spent our money on a cripled product and you don't even have the intention or the decensy to do something about it.

    So I will say it again:

    Zen studios: You should be ashamed of yourself. DEEPLY ashamed.

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    Senior Member Tech101's Avatar
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    And yet another satisfied customer!
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    Dear ZEN Studios,

    Can I get my money back please?

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    LOL... I have made exactly the same post on Facebook, but they have removed it from their page.

    Well done guys... Just stick your head in the ground and ignore this situation....

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    Angry

    LOL.. and again removed from FB within 5 minutes!

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    Senior Member Tech101's Avatar
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    Well are you at least removing the S word? They will keep removing it if you don't and who knows they may still after that.

    I get it but I can only complain so much before I just get tired of the whole situation. How does the saying go. If people are complaining then they want to be satisfied but if they are saying nothing they have moved on and no longer care about your product.

    Take the complaining as loyal customers wanting to give you money and not just some annoying group that needs to be silenced.
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    Senior Member Rafie's Avatar
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    You're probably not getting a response back from them because of the delivery of your complaint. Keep a cool head when you're complaining. I'm sure they (Zen) knows that Wii U owners...AND 3DS owners are pretty upset about the lack of content on their platforms. However, cursing in all of that mess won't make the situation any more better. I won't defend any practices from either side, but I definitely sympathize with you. I buy Zen's tables on the Wii U and 3DS as well. I hope we hear something soon.

    P.S. Don't mean to sound like an apologist for them, I'm just giving you another view to look at it from when people like Barbie are handling complaints. Don't stop complaining about what you feel is wrong, just do it in a more subtle way.
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    To be quite honest: after one year of waiting and waiting, I actually think the above reaction is quite decent. If "shit" is already considered to be "swearing" these days. Phew... It's not like I have used the f-word in my complaint.
    Besides that: I think that what ZEN studios is doing is quite a bit worse then using the word "shit". And the fact that people are loosing interest in ZEN studio's work is their own mistake?
    Just take a look at the statistics in the first 3 tables of Starwars and in the 2nd batch. That gives you a fairly good insight in how much less people have bought the 2nd batch of tables. And who can blame them? ZEN has left their Nintendo customers in the cold for quite some time now. And I am acutally surprised that some people are still able to defend this situation.

    There has been a nice boost in WiiU sales lately, so this might spark some new interest from ZEN Studio's side. But, I am willing to put some money on it that we will only see new products for which they can charge money instead of some bugfixes which should have been released a year ago.

    @Rafie: Really... you actually think that using the word "shit" one time is "cursing"?

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    Senior Member Tech101's Avatar
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    Yes using that word one time is cursing. Plus on Facebook a ton more people will see it as opposed to these forums. I don't swear at all so yes seeing the word even once offends me and how you use it adds even more impact to it.

    I've actually seen a few new people playing the game as of late and even helped one out to make some discussions. I warned him off of Spider-Man and that's a shame. Told him everything wrong with it as well. They say bad news travels faster then good news. I also know people holding off on the New Star Wars pack till they hear about a fix. I told my person it's been hit or miss but if you get the freezing it's pretty much unplayable.

    I have every table offered to Nintendo from Zen on both the U and 3ds and I play them and love them but I also know of the flaws and work around to fix some of them however annoying that is.

    Too bad They don't see a reason to fix the Star Wars crashing bug. They say not enough people are experiencing them when I hear differently. I personally know of about 6 people that hate playing them because of the crashing which is really bad btw.
    Last edited by Tech101; 08-05-2014 at 03:12 PM.
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    Exclamation

    Hmmm, just noticed you both are from the US... That explains a bit I guess. The country that prouds itself on "free speech", but where you can't say "sh*t" or "f*ck" on public TV. I guess I don't watch MTV enough anymore where these words indeed get consored ;-)
    Here on the other side of the great big ocean, we look a bit differently to these words. Although the f-word of is actually considered swearing though.

    I still consider the text I wrote in the TS to be quite mild, considering what ZEN has done (or actually hasn't done) And it really doesn't matter how you put it I guess. Zen is in it for the money (Who can blame them? They are a commercial company), but they really should take a moment and think of what they wan't to do with the WiiU in the future and be clear about it, or else it will be to late...
    If I remember correctly, I saw +/- a 1 to 6 ratio of users on the 1st & 2nd set of StarWars tables... That's what you get from leaving your customers in the cold.

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    Senior Member Rafie's Avatar
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    My mother curses like a sailor. So words like that don't bother me. However, if you're writing a complaint to a company and/or organization...you wouldn't curse to get your point across. Yes people still do it, but you run the risk of that said complaint thrown to the waste side because of the attitude of the OP. The curse word "s*#$" is being more excepted in regular tv, but is still considered bad language.

    Like I said, no one isn't telling you to not be upset or complain. Just do it without the cursing and name-calling (I know you didn't call any names). I hope Ninty gets some news soon about future tables. That would be awesome and soothe some disgruntlement across the board.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rafie View Post
    My mother curses like a sailor. So words like that don't bother me. However, if you're writing a complaint to a company and/or organization...you wouldn't curse to get your point across. Yes people still do it, but you run the risk of that said complaint thrown to the waste side because of the attitude of the OP. The curse word "s*#$" is being more excepted in regular tv, but is still considered bad language.

    Like I said, no one isn't telling you to not be upset or complain. Just do it without the cursing and name-calling (I know you didn't call any names). I hope Ninty gets some news soon about future tables. That would be awesome and soothe some disgruntlement across the board.
    I would prefer that they would actually fix some bugs first, instead of making money on us again with some products that might be flawed again. I've always learned to fix my mistakes before going on to the next project.
    My customers won't buy a new product from me, if I keep selling them cripled products and not solving these issues first.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tfhfony View Post
    Hmmm, just noticed you both are from the US... That explains a bit I guess. The country that prouds itself on "free speech", but where you can't say "sh*t" or "f*ck" on public TV.
    It is surprising how many people think that freedom of speech means that they can say whatever they want without consequence. If you act like a jerk or are disrespectful and use words that others might find offensive, private citizens and businesses have the freedom to ignore you. The US government can't censor you or arrest you for voicing your beliefs (with exceptions like inciting violence, fighting words, libel and slander, child pornography). But if you think that free speech means that you have the right to be disrespectful or use offensive language without consequence, you are wrong.

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    Senior Member shogun00's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by surf1der View Post
    It is surprising how many people think that freedom of speech means that they can say whatever they want without consequence. If you act like a jerk or are disrespectful and use words that others might find offensive, private citizens and businesses have the freedom to ignore you. The US government can't censor you or arrest you for voicing your beliefs (with exceptions like inciting violence, fighting words, libel and slander, child pornography). But if you think that free speech means that you have the right to be disrespectful or use offensive language without consequence, you are wrong.
    +1

    Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but that doesn't mean the others are not entitled to disagree or ignore it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by surf1der View Post
    It is surprising how many people think that freedom of speech means that they can say whatever they want without consequence.
    Euh... Where did I say that? I agree with you that freedom of speech & opinion come with quite some responsibilities.

    If you act like a jerk or are disrespectful and use words that others might find offensive, private citizens and businesses have the freedom to ignore you.
    So using the word "sh*t* in your book makes someone a jerk?
    I must say I am a bit surprised about your reactions over here on the word "sh*t". If that word is already a reason for so many concerns for you guys, pfff.. The internet and real life must be like a horror-show.

    The US government can't censor you or arrest you for voicing your beliefs (with exceptions like inciting violence, fighting words, libel and slander, child pornography). But if you think that free speech means that you have the right to be disrespectful or use offensive language without consequence, you are wrong.
    Well. I guess it's just like capitalism lets you sell products which are flawed, and that you as a customer can't do anything about it. ZEN has been quite good in ignoring less stronger complaints about this issue...

    Anyway, the next time I will post a complaint, I will use the word "Feces" on this forum ;-)

    Oh, and besides: I would be carefull not to use the search function on this forum with the s-word. It has been mentiond on this forum quite some times before, without any shocked reactions. Not from you, not from others. One of those "sh*t's" on this forum is actually from one of you guys
    Sorry, but I think you guys are really overreaction. And not just a little bit...
    Last edited by tfhfony; 08-06-2014 at 09:01 AM.

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    Senior Member crackervizzo's Avatar
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    Actually, we will have some very big Wii U news very soon. This is a difficult platform to support from a technology standpoint. Simple patches are not simple. New content additions are not easy due to the way the system is set up. We are committed to supporting Wii U. Again, please look for an announcement in the coming weeks. Thanks for supporting Zen Studios.

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    Please do not curse here. We try to keep this open and friendly for everyone. I hear your concerns and issues and agree that we have not supported you properly. We are working to make this right.

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    Senior Member Tech101's Avatar
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    Thank you so much for this response!
    Proud member of the Hyna Gang! Keeping pinball alive on the Wii U!

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    Senior Member shogun00's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by crackervizzo View Post
    Actually, we will have some very big Wii U news very soon. This is a difficult platform to support from a technology standpoint. Simple patches are not simple. New content additions are not easy due to the way the system is set up.
    I've been hearing this from a few indie developers now, especially when it comes to those that rely heavily on DLC and patches. I'm not surprised, since Nintendo seems to be always behind with the times.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tfhfony View Post
    Euh... Where did I say that? I agree with you that freedom of speech & opinion come with quite some responsibilities.


    So using the word "sh*t* in your book makes someone a jerk?
    I must say I am a bit surprised about your reactions over here on the word "sh*t". If that word is already a reason for so many concerns for you guys, pfff.. The internet and real life must be like a horror-show.


    Well. I guess it's just like capitalism lets you sell products which are flawed, and that you as a customer can't do anything about it. ZEN has been quite good in ignoring less stronger complaints about this issue...

    Anyway, the next time I will post a complaint, I will use the word "Feces" on this forum ;-)

    Oh, and besides: I would be carefull not to use the search function on this forum with the s-word. It has been mentiond on this forum quite some times before, without any shocked reactions. Not from you, not from others. One of those "sh*t's" on this forum is actually from one of you guys
    Sorry, but I think you guys are really overreaction. And not just a little bit...

    Lol. So sensitive. I don't think you understood my post at all. You can whine and moan all you like. You can be immature and demand your money back and make ridiculous comments about capitalism. It seems to be the only way to get a response from Zen. My comment was directed at your misguided comment about how Americans "prouds (sic) itself on free speech" and somehow you find a disconnect between that principle and the fact that you can't say curse words on broadcast television and why your comments got deleted. The reason why your comments got deleted has nothing to do with free speech. I know Barbie rarely ever deletes posts and it is usually because of cursing or personal attacks against her or another forum member. You have to realize that this game is rated for all ages and that zen doesn't want their social media littered with foul-mouthed comments.

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    Senior Member shogun00's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by surf1der View Post
    You have to realize that this game is rated for all ages and that zen doesn't want their social media littered with foul-mouthed comments.
    Bingo! Not to mention, there was a set of guidelines that we agreed to when we signed up to this forum.

    One of those guidelines clearly states:
    You may not use profanity. It is unprofessional and offensive and will not be tolerated. We have word filters in place for the most vulgar terms. Circumventing those word filters will result in punitive action.

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    Senior Member Everly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by crackervizzo View Post
    I hear your concerns and issues and agree that we have not supported you properly. We are working to make this right.
    This acknowledgement. This simple statement right here has restored some of my faith. Thank you Mel! It's nice to feel like we are important. I really hope you can make this happen.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Everly View Post
    This acknowledgement. This simple statement right here has restored some of my faith. Thank you Mel! It's nice to feel like we are important. I really hope you can make this happen.
    It's good to see you back! I was hoping you seen this!
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    Quote Originally Posted by surf1der View Post
    Lol. So sensitive. I don't think you understood my post at all. You can whine and moan all you like. You can be immature and demand your money back and make ridiculous comments about capitalism. It seems to be the only way to get a response from Zen. My comment was directed at your misguided comment about how Americans "prouds (sic) itself on free speech" and somehow you find a disconnect between that principle and the fact that you can't say curse words on broadcast television and why your comments got deleted. The reason why your comments got deleted has nothing to do with free speech. I know Barbie rarely ever deletes posts and it is usually because of cursing or personal attacks against her or another forum member. You have to realize that this game is rated for all ages and that zen doesn't want their social media littered with foul-mouthed comments.
    Well, the only "foulmouthed" word in that original text is "sh*t", and Google tells me that they haven't had any problem with that word before. Not on this forum, not on their Facebook page. So your story doesn't add up. Smple...
    The whole point for deleting that post on Facebook is just the negative content. Quite simple as that.

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    Nice to see Zen Studios again finally acknowledge the Wii U's existence and the fact that they have alot of players are still on Wii U. I'm not a huge follower like alot people here, but I wasn't impressed to see Nintendo fans shunted out of the picture and concerns not acknowledge. Hopefully Zen can restore our faith!
    Nintendo Feed's main man and all round awesome guy - I like Nintendo, and more recently, Pinball!

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    Quote Originally Posted by crackervizzo View Post
    I hear your concerns and issues and agree that we have not supported you properly. We are working to make this right.
    Remember this way back when? The promise of better times laying ahead for Wii U owners. Not getting content after everyone else. Working leaderboards. Yeah....that would have been nice.

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    Senior Member Tech101's Avatar
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    Lets face it they've moved on. Everything makes more money on the other formats and it doesn't make sense to continue to have to do separate development for just Nintendo. 100$ says they have an NX dev kit and are working on that since it's suppose to be port friendly. The best thing Nintendo could do it make the system as user friendly as possible for 3rd parties.
    Proud member of the Hyna Gang! Keeping pinball alive on the Wii U!

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    Senior Member Everly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tech101 View Post
    Lets face it they've moved on.
    Yes, I agree. The last post in this section of the forum started by Zen representative with news for us was over 8 months ago. I've sort of moved on as well. I know there are tables on the Wii U that I haven't bought. That was unheard of last year at this time.

    To be honest, I couldn't even tell you what tables have been announced in the last 6 months, but I'd bet dollar to dime they aren't on the Wii U.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tech101 View Post
    Lets face it they've moved on. Everything makes more money on the other formats and it doesn't make sense to continue to have to do separate development for just Nintendo. 100$ says they have an NX dev kit and are working on that since it's suppose to be port friendly. The best thing Nintendo could do it make the system as user friendly as possible for 3rd parties.
    We have not stopped supporting Wii U - it takes a lot more time to develop for Wii U, which I have explained before. I will post Wii U news as soon as we have it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BarbieBobomb View Post
    We have not stopped supporting Wii U - it takes a lot more time to develop for Wii U, which I have explained before. I will post Wii U news as soon as we have it.
    I'm just commenting on the fact that nothing really changed since Mel's comment that we have not been supported well (his words not mine) and that Zen Studios was working to make things right.

    To be honest the only change I've seen in the last year is that people no longer ask if a newly released table will be available on the Wii U at launch. They just know it won't be.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Everly View Post
    I'm just commenting on the fact that nothing really changed since Mel's comment that we have not been supported well (his words not mine) and that Zen Studios was working to make things right.

    To be honest the only change I've seen in the last year is that people no longer ask if a newly released table will be available on the Wii U at launch. They just know it won't be.
    Indeed. I've stopped expecting anything from ZEN when it comes down to the WiiU.
    I've moved on as well, but to the PS4 and I have been playing The Pinball Arcade on that machine. I have installed Zen Pinball 2 as well with one table, but won't purchase the tables for the PS4. I've already spend way to much money on ZP2 without getting what I deserved and paid for.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tfhfony View Post
    Indeed. I've stopped expecting anything from ZEN when it comes down to the WiiU.
    I've moved on as well, but to the PS4 and I have been playing The Pinball Arcade on that machine. I have installed Zen Pinball 2 as well with one table, but won't purchase the tables for the PS4. I've already spend way to much money on ZP2 without getting what I deserved and paid for.
    I would like to get a PS4. I was curious to know how Pinball Arcade played. Do you enjoy it!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Everly View Post
    I would like to get a PS4. I was curious to know how Pinball Arcade played. Do you enjoy it!
    It's awesome! Especially with the night mode. I've uploaded a few videos onto Youtube with the share function.

    Note: The PS4 share feature does a lot of compression (reduces frame rate and resolution), but it gives you a good idea what the game is like.

    Black Knight 2000
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    Quote Originally Posted by shogun00 View Post
    It's awesome! Especially with the night mode. I've uploaded a few videos onto Youtube with the share function.

    Note: The PS4 share feature does a lot of compression (reduces frame rate and resolution), but it gives you a good idea what the game is like.

    Black Knight 2000
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    There was a Black Knight table at the arcade I would go to as a kid. That was a fun table. I wish they would make Swords of Fury. My buddy and I played that one all the time.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tfhfony View Post
    Zen studios: You should be ashamed of yourself. DEEPLY ashamed.

    Why? Quite simple. Me, and thousands of other WiiU users have paid for mulitple tables in ZEN Pinball 2. There are still bugs in these tables, we have brought to your attention over a year ago. The Spiderman table is one of the worst ones where after every multiball the screen doesn't return to it's correct setting.
    In over a year, you haven't done SHIT for us to solve these issues. We haven't had an official tournament EVER since this game was released.

    Zen studios: You should be ashamed of yourself. DEEPLY ashamed.

    Dude, chill out. I mean, talk about an overreaction. The camera doesn't change back? Here's a fix: Click the "C" button. That changes the camera back. Seriously, talk about having a privileged special-little-flower attitude for a minor problem, which, by the way, is not technically even a bug. Sometimes minor annoyances happen. My advice? Try not to act like a crying child about it. It's doubtful *any* company is going to devote employee hours to something that barely has any effect on a single game.

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