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Thread: New tables sort of announced

  1. #1
    Senior Member DiscoKing's Avatar
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    Default New tables sort of announced

    Ok I just read an article interview with Mel Kirk the VP of of publishing from Zen.

    Here are the tidbits of new tables:
    1. More marvel tables on the way - no surprise
    2. More Star Wars tables on the way - no surprise
    3. Tables based on New partnerships to be revealed (only some in 2015)
    4. Two more original tables based on the iron and steel theme
    • 1 based on Greek mythology
    • 1 based on a sports theme park motif


    Also stated they are working on the next iteration of pinball (I think that means zen pinball 3)
    • They want users to be able to create their own tournaments
    • They want to make the game more social with esports
    • Players can create their own pinball leagues
    • Barring any technical or licensing limitations - All old tables will carry over to the new game! Zen says they care about customer loyalty!


    Well that's all I saw in the article about new stuff. Let's hear the comments...


    Btw I think Greek mythology table sounds super cool

    Btw which one is first Barbie?

  2. #2
    Senior Member snakeman07's Avatar
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    All of it sounds good to me! Being able to create our own tournaments will be awesome!

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    This game can only become exciting again with a new release of the base game – FX3 or whatever.

    So in that respect Im pleased to see they are working on an update (although they were saying that several years ago as well!).

    I know I am in a minority but I don’t understand the obsession with keeping all the old tables.
    I would keep FX2 as a legacy platform so you can still play those tables if you want but start afresh with the new one.

    Although flawed I liked the superscore system on Xbox 360. That worked because the tables were released gradually.
    Now if you want to compete in that sort of space you are immediately dumped with having to play 40+ tables you have
    had for years and played the death out of – not fun.

    No mention of new game modes? (I only read the post above not the article). I hope that some are included.

    Creating your own tournaments is a good idea but should be limited (perhaps 1 a month per person) or else it will be spammed
    into irrelevance.

    Oh and some decent achievements would be nice – the Farsight basic / wizard goals is a great system and serves as a tutorial as well.

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    Senior Member Mammouth's Avatar
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    I agree with Alipan with the support of the old tables. For 10 tables, i will be ok with that but for 50+, i think it's a lot of work for the studio to handle with, and i'm afraid it might impact the quality of new tables at the beginning. I don't care if i can't play Paranormal or V12 or any first outdated table on ZP3. Some tables need to rest in peace, they were very good at first but are outclassed now, and some tables must not be resurrect from the deads.

    I will be a little sad to not have a few tables on the new engine but if it can be traded for better quality, that's a trade i can make happily.
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    I respectfully disagree - keep all the tables as they are always fun to go back to after a break -believe that's called a high replay value. In fact I would also argue for a complete comprehensive library. - there are many tables that people have never gotten to play due to them not being available on their platform.

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    Senior Member MarkItZeroSmoky's Avatar
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    This sounds promising with some of the extra feature, but im gonna have to agree with Alipan and Mammoth about the 50 old tables. I dont think we need the majority of older tables on Zp3. They are already in at least 2 versions on Ps3 platform between Marvel Pin, Zp2 and Star Wars standalone. We have all those tables in the ps4 version of Zp2.

    This also brings to question Sony's trophy cap, which no one really knows yet if they have lifted or extended the cap on ps4. Do we really want to allocate potentially 100 trophies that we already have at least 3, and up to 5 different platforms/versions of to earn already between the 2 standalones (Marvel and Star Wars) Zp2 on Ps3 and 4, plus the Vita?

    And I dont get the love for TPA's trophy sytem. Its about as lame as it can get. There is no uniqueness at all to them. Nothing but "Standard Goals" and "Wizard Goals" on tables. Not to mention the standard goals are mostly a joke, and can be earned by anyone with relatively decent skill in the first game of most of their tables. I'd much rather have the unique trophy titles and tiles that correspond to each individual table. And if you get a Wizard mode Trophy in Zen, its pretty much guarenteed that youve done everything necessary that you would need to do to earn all the Wizard "Goals". There may be a couple minor exceptions, but Zen usually throws those in as the secondary Trophy. Please keep the trophies as is. Theres no need to copy from Farsight on that.

    I would like to see a fan vote on which of the older tables to bring over to Zp3. Maybe 15 or 20 of the fan favorites would suffice.

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by MarkItZeroSmoky View Post

    I would like to see a fan vote on which of the older tables to bring over to Zp3. Maybe 15 or 20 of the fan favorites would suffice.
    This wouldn't necessarily give us any useful data. This would only tell us what a handful of people who care enough about transfers want, and wouldn't necessarily be representative of the whole community. Besides, we've already said we will bring over any tables we can.

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    Senior Member Beliskner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarkItZeroSmoky View Post
    This also brings to question Sony's trophy cap, which no one really knows yet if they have lifted or extended the cap on ps4. Do we really want to allocate potentially 100 trophies that we already have at least 3, and up to 5 different platforms/versions of to earn already between the 2 standalones (Marvel and Star Wars) Zp2 on Ps3 and 4, plus the Vita?
    I don't really see a problem there. Zen can bring the tables over without giving everyone of those a trophy again. DLC's aren't required to have trophies.

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    User created tournaments and pinball leagues I kind of hit the nail on the head when I requested those features. http://forum.zenstudios.com/showthre...light=features
    I am sure they were already working on it before I suggested it but I like the direction they are taking the series. I haven't played much pinball the past year. Mostly been playing Hearthstone surprisingly enough (my first CCG). But pinball leagues would definitely get me back into the game. @Discoking, was the article online? Do you have link for it?

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    Senior Member MarkItZeroSmoky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beliskner View Post
    I don't really see a problem there. Zen can bring the tables over without giving everyone of those a trophy again. DLC's aren't required to have trophies.
    This is true, a point I did not consider. This would alleviate any potential issues and still bring all the tables to the new engine/version.

    Quote Originally Posted by BarbieBobomb View Post
    This wouldn't necessarily give us any useful data. This would only tell us what a handful of people who care enough about transfers want, and wouldn't necessarily be representative of the whole community. Besides, we've already said we will bring over any tables we can.
    Fair enough, another point taken. It your guys' workload Cant wait to see whats in store for us.

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    Nice. In regards to having all the tables in the new 'Version', I'd say heck yes. I still play all the 'older' tables. There has always been nostalgia. If you are pinball lover why not have all the tables to you in one version and not have to stop, quit FX3, start FX2 and play the tables then quit FX2 and start FX3 again to play the tables they have?

    Tournament options are great. We haven't had one in a long time.

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    Senior Member DiscoKing's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by surf1der View Post
    @Discoking, was the article online? Do you have link for it?
    Sadly no. The article was in a magazine. I was thumbing through and saw a picture of portal pinball so I read the article most of it was how the magazine liked the latest 3 tables: rebels, Ultron, & portal. Then at the end is about all the new stuff. Which I typed in here the only thing I left out about new stuff was the fact that zen is making a new game based in physics but not pinball and that was all that was said about it. Any new pinball info I put in the original post.

    I am looking forward to Greek mythology that sounds like it could be really cool - a lot of source material to draw from.

    All we need now is for Barbie to tell us which one is coming next and maybe some hints as to what the next marvel table will be agh em Barbie.....

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoKing View Post

    All we need now is for Barbie to tell us which one is coming next and maybe some hints as to what the next marvel table will be agh em Barbie.....
    Sorry - no details yet

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    Senior Member shogun00's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoKing View Post
    Sadly no. The article was in a magazine. I was thumbing through and saw a picture of portal pinball so I read the article most of it was how the magazine liked the latest 3 tables: rebels, Ultron, & portal. Then at the end is about all the new stuff. Which I typed in here the only thing I left out about new stuff was the fact that zen is making a new game based in physics but not pinball and that was all that was said about it. Any new pinball info I put in the original post.
    Ah! The one in Game Informer. I posted about it last month in the General Discussion section.

    http://forum.zenstudios.com/showthre...-Game-Informer

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    Quote Originally Posted by shogun00 View Post
    Ah! The one in Game Informer. I posted about it last month in the General Discussion section.

    http://forum.zenstudios.com/showthre...-Game-Informer
    Hmm How did that post get past me. Likely because it was in the General discussion which I rarely visit.


    Now if we could get some of the older tables redone for this combined platform. Buccaneer, Agents etc I would love to try those. Have never had a chance to play them and likely never will. I would so much look forward to that.

    Looking forward to the Mythology one. Love Mythology.

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    Senior Member Cloda's Avatar
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    I have been holding back on buying a PS4/XBox One as I have been waiting for Zen Pinball 3 / Pinball FX 3. Currently I play FX 2 on Xbox 360 and that is about the only game I still play on there as the rest I play on Mac/PC (where you generally pay much cheaper for exactly the same game). Unless there is a huge improvement in terms of physics/details/visuals etc. for the new version of the game there will be absolutely no reason for me to purchase a new console. Basically, my thoughts are that if the new version of the game has to be compromised to accommodate the legacy tables, it will not be worth it for me. Zen should really aim to up the game-play similarly to as what they did when FX 2 came out. Even though I love pinball, I hated FX 1 and could not get myself to spend any time on it as it was just not good enough but then FX 2 came out and it basically transformed my game-playing life. Anyway, that kind of jump is what I hope and expect from FX 3, which have been talked about for at least the last 3 years, and bringing legacy tables over should not be allowed to hold the new versions back in any way.
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    Writer of Guides ShoryukenToTheChin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shogun00 View Post
    Ah! The one in Game Informer. I posted about it last month in the General Discussion section.

    http://forum.zenstudios.com/showthre...-Game-Informer
    Jeez yeh I absolutely missed that thread as well.

    Either way it all sounds good to me, but I want to know one thing...... whats its release date


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    Table Designer deep's Avatar
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    Hey mythology lovers,
    I would love to hear what are you expect from a table based on greek mythology. Don't be shy and share your ideas, even if it isn't connected strictly to the theme. Any feature ideas are welcome!

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    Senior Member Cloda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deep View Post
    Hey mythology lovers,
    I would love to hear what are you expect from a table based on greek mythology. Don't be shy and share your ideas, even if it isn't connected strictly to the theme. Any feature ideas are welcome!
    How about looking at it from the perspective of the constellations... loads of material to work with e.g. Scorpius and Orion being at opposite sides of the sky and the Milky-way will provide a beautiful backdrop for the table.
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    Quote Originally Posted by deep View Post
    Hey mythology lovers,
    I would love to hear what are you expect from a table based on greek mythology. Don't be shy and share your ideas, even if it isn't connected strictly to the theme. Any feature ideas are welcome!
    Titans vs Olympians.
    Demigods vs Monsters
    Labours of Heracles (Hercules)
    Iliad/Trojan War
    Odyssey

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    Junior Member Sun Vulcan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deep View Post
    Hey mythology lovers,
    I would love to hear what are you expect from a table based on greek mythology. Don't be shy and share your ideas, even if it isn't connected strictly to the theme. Any feature ideas are welcome!
    I'd like to see a Saint Seiya table about the Sanctuary Saga.
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    Senior Member DiscoKing's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deep View Post
    Hey mythology lovers,
    I would love to hear what are you expect from a table based on greek mythology. Don't be shy and share your ideas, even if it isn't connected strictly to the theme. Any feature ideas are welcome!
    A mission for some main Gods or goddesses (the big 3 are a must)
    Zues
    Posiden
    Hades


    Side missions can be stuff like
    Medusa
    Minotaur's maze
    Ride Pegasus
    Battle hydra
    The kraken


    I don't really know but there are the things I'd like to see in it

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    Senior Member Beliskner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoKing View Post
    A mission for some main Gods or goddesses (the big 3 are a must)
    Zues
    Posiden
    Hades


    Side missions can be stuff like
    Medusa
    Minotaur's maze
    Ride Pegasus
    Battle hydra
    The kraken


    I don't really know but there are the things I'd like to see in it
    Add Prometheus and Tantalus to that list. Two of my favorite greek tales

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    Writer of Guides ShoryukenToTheChin's Avatar
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    Red face The 12 Labors of Heracles!

    Quote Originally Posted by deep View Post
    Hey mythology lovers,
    I would love to hear what are you expect from a table based on greek mythology. Don't be shy and share your ideas, even if it isn't connected strictly to the theme. Any feature ideas are welcome!
    Heracles is a must if you ask me, perhaps 12 Main Missions linked to his 12 Labors.

    If we were looking a license based Greek Mythology, then fricking God of War would literally be a godsend


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    Senior Member Beliskner's Avatar
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    Also Zeus and Hades Multiball. Kinda have them in a way that Sith and Jedi Multiballs were on Episode V so that they are activated in similar ways and are stackable for crazy points .
    Actually I'd rather have the gods appear in side modes like multiballs and stuff and for main missions I'd like to see more of the mortal action like Troy and the Odyssey of course. Lots of awesome stuff to work with there and stuff that most people will be familiar with compared to the god myths
    Oh and you gotta have Prometheus tied up somewhere on the field even if it's just a gimmick .

  26. #26
    Senior Member Rafie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoKing View Post
    A mission for some main Gods or goddesses (the big 3 are a must)
    Zues
    Posiden
    Hades


    Side missions can be stuff like
    Medusa
    Minotaur's maze
    Ride Pegasus
    Battle hydra
    The kraken


    I don't really know but there are the things I'd like to see in it
    Maybe some Hercules Labor missions or so. Greek Mythology is so broad that there's endless themes to go with. We just gotta narrow it down to just a few.
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    Senior Member snakeman07's Avatar
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    I gotta admit, I really like the idea of the 12 labors of Hercules. Imagine doing them all on one run, it's double the typical amount of table missions, but it will be worth it

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    Quote Originally Posted by deep View Post
    Hey mythology lovers,
    I would love to hear what are you expect from a table based on greek mythology. Don't be shy and share your ideas, even if it isn't connected strictly to the theme. Any feature ideas are welcome!
    It would be cool to have an Apollo mission where the pinball turns into the sun. Well... a miniature version. You know what I mean.
    Zen Pinball 2 n00b Favourite tables: South Park Super Sweet, Return of the Jedi, Darth Vader, Han Solo, Tesla, Wild West, Butters.

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    Just for the general tone I would like to see the mythology table done ‘straight’ with the same sort of vibe as the Rome table.

    I don’t want to see any cutesey characters like Epic Quest or cartoon Krakens.

  30. #30

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    Zeus' Polymorphing Mating Quest!

    Zeus' missions revolve around transforming into other men, women, animals, etc.!


    On a serious note, regardless of what they add in the next iteration, I'd absolutely love to see the unified leaderboards from all the various ecosystem platforms. Specifically PS3/PS4/Vita.
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    Quote Originally Posted by deep View Post
    Hey mythology lovers,
    I would love to hear what are you expect from a table based on greek mythology. Don't be shy and share your ideas, even if it isn't connected strictly to the theme. Any feature ideas are welcome!
    I say don't make it an original. Do a Zen version of Wrath of Olympus
    https://vimeo.com/129359170

    Make it cross promotional. Maybe they can get some money out of it to help them get this table built and maybe you guys will pick up a bunch of new customers from pinside of people that are dying for it to get made.


    Also I'm guessing some of the news in the first post is about you guys possibly partnering with Stern? If you're looking at making sim tables then start with WOOLY!

  32. #32
    Senior Member Beliskner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metalzoic View Post
    Also I'm guessing some of the news in the first post is about you guys possibly partnering with Stern? If you're looking at making sim tables then start with WOOLY!
    What makes you think so?
    Also I really wouldn't want Zen to put actual tables in their game. The real tables were made with real physics in mind while Zen is completely different from that and as a result a real table simply wouldn't work at all in Zen Pinball. Maybe it would but I can see the "That's not how it's supposed to be. Pinball Arcade did it so much better" jerks coming out flaming everything. Zen could only lose if they'd put real tables in their games.

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    Junior Member Retrogammer1977SB's Avatar
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    No E3 News from Zen???

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beliskner View Post
    What makes you think so?
    Also I really wouldn't want Zen to put actual tables in their game. The real tables were made with real physics in mind while Zen is completely different from that and as a result a real table simply wouldn't work at all in Zen Pinball. Maybe it would but I can see the "That's not how it's supposed to be. Pinball Arcade did it so much better" jerks coming out flaming everything. Zen could only lose if they'd put real tables in their games.
    Maybe because of this https://twitter.com/zen_studios/stat...92149700792320

    Quote Originally Posted by Retrogammer1977SB View Post
    No E3 News from Zen???
    Nope - nothing to speak of publicly, we're doing more behind the scenes type of stuff at E3 this year

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    Quote Originally Posted by BarbieBobomb View Post
    Stern is awesome. In fact all companies that still make machines are. I still stand by it though: I don't want to see real machines in Zen Pinball. If you do want to make them just make a seperate game for those

  36. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beliskner View Post
    Stern is awesome. In fact all companies that still make machines are. I still stand by it though: I don't want to see real machines in Zen Pinball. If you do want to make them just make a seperate game for those
    Why not?

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    Quote Originally Posted by BarbieBobomb View Post
    Why not?
    Yeah why not? I don't care if they are part of the zen pinball collection or standalone - just bring them please!!!!

    I know this is all pre- speculation - but my hopes are definitely up!

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    Senior Member Beliskner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BarbieBobomb View Post
    Why not?
    Like I said in a previous post: I highly doubt Zen physics could work on real tables. At least not without making changes to the table and maybe rerwriting the ROM of the original machines from scratch. That's one of the problems I have with The Pinball Arcade. They copied the ROMs of the original tables 1-to-1 into their game but sometimes when the physics or the modeling of the table is just slightly of some shots became nearly impossible to make or the whole table became even more unfair or waaaaay easier than in real life. I don't know if you played it but I'm not exaggerating when I say that some tables are complete disasters that aren't fun whatsoever.
    Here's what I think would be best if you'd do real tables:
    1. Take a real table and make it your own. Basically remodeling everything so it fits the classic Zen style and physics and it feels like I'm still playing Zen Pinball.
    2. Take a real table and try to do a simulation. Again I've played both Zen Pinball and Pinball Arcade as well as several other Pinball games. They're all drastically different and require a completely different skill- and mindset. They are as different as Gran Turismo and Mario Kart are and you wouldn#t mix those two together would you?

    I'm playing Zen Pinball because of three things: Control, flow and the amazing creativity that you put into the table design. Real Pinball tables aren't made so the player can control the ball and make amazing combo shots. Even the best Pinball players in the world struggle on the real machines with both of these things. And as far as creativity goes: Well the whole entire creativity lies with the people who design the actual machine and not the company who puts it in the game. Why would you want to limit yourself like that? I'd like to remind you of the awesomeness that is the Infinity Gauntlet table. All the crazy stuff that is going on with the upside down table, reversed flippers etc. That was one of the most amazing things I ever played in my life. Those tables that just don't care about the laws of nature are so much more exciting to play. I'd pick one of those any day over a table where my only thought the entire time is: "Oh my god table please don't cheat on me this shot."

    Maybe this post feels overly negative to some. I'm just really skeptical and not overly excited like some other people when they hear "real tables" for some reason. The fact that these tables exist in real life don't make them better and putting them in a game certainly doesn't either. I was always honest when I praised the work of Zen Studios and also stated my opinion on the tables I didn't like as much. The concerns I expressed here are no exception and I hope everyone can understand the points I made in this post

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beliskner View Post
    Like I said in a previous post: I highly doubt Zen physics could work on real tables. At least not without making changes to the table and maybe rerwriting the ROM of the original machines from scratch. That's one of the problems I have with The Pinball Arcade. They copied the ROMs of the original tables 1-to-1 into their game but sometimes when the physics or the modeling of the table is just slightly of some shots became nearly impossible to make or the whole table became even more unfair or waaaaay easier than in real life. I don't know if you played it but I'm not exaggerating when I say that some tables are complete disasters that aren't fun whatsoever.
    Here's what I think would be best if you'd do real tables:
    1. Take a real table and make it your own. Basically remodeling everything so it fits the classic Zen style and physics and it feels like I'm still playing Zen Pinball.
    2. Take a real table and try to do a simulation. Again I've played both Zen Pinball and Pinball Arcade as well as several other Pinball games. They're all drastically different and require a completely different skill- and mindset. They are as different as Gran Turismo and Mario Kart are and you wouldn#t mix those two together would you?
    I guess I don't understand why you would think they couldn't simply change their physics to properly reflect a real table. Why do you automatically think they would mix them together? Zen has already shown they create awesome original tables so why would you think they wouldn't be good at re-creating the real thing?

    We already know their quality control and presentation are far better than the other guys. I don't doubt their physics would probably show the same polish.

    Anyway, here's more. Originally posted by Shutyertrap

    https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...53368360379244

    Now check out the comments, specifically this exchange...

    Mike Haakenson If somehow a deal could be made for a company like zen to make digital versions of the new games so you could try them out I think it would increase interest in buying a new in box for some people.
    Like · Reply · 12 hours ago

    Stern Pinball ........
    Like · 7 hours ago

    Mike Haakenson This blank response excites me!
    Like · 7 hours ago

  40. #40
    Senior Member Beliskner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metalzoic View Post
    I guess I don't understand why you would think they couldn't simply change their physics to properly reflect a real table. Why do you automatically think they would mix them together? Zen has already shown they create awesome original tables so why would you think they wouldn't be good at re-creating the real thing?

    We already know their quality control and presentation are far better than the other guys. I don't doubt their physics would probably show the same polish.
    Where díd I say any of that? Of course Zen could change their physics to be more realistic (whatever that means nowadays). See option number 2 I wrote down.
    I expressed in my post how physics in Pinball games make them completely different which is why I think real physics don't belong in a Zen Pinball that also features the physics we are used to from that game.
    I also never said anywhere that Zen wouldn't be good at recreating the real thing. I just said that real tables aren't necessarily better than digital-only tables. I know how good Zen is at developing their stuff but keep in mind that there is a lot of very deep thought in the real tables as far as positioning of targets, ramps etc. goes so that the table is actually playable. Zen physics and design however are more forgiving and the design doesn't have to be perfect to work really well still. With a real table though if there's just a slight mishap with anything it can ruin the entire experience no matter how good the rest of the table is.

    I do realise that tastes are different and if some people want real tables I can understand that. It's just not my cup of tea when they're in video games because of the reasons I mentioned.

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